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geekgirles · 2 years ago

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Liar Revealed

So Marinette and Sabrina worked together to lure Lila into a false sense of security that eventually led up to her spilling everything in front of an audience she was unaware of. Now everyone knows she’s been lying about everything, she’s a horrible person, and she and Chloé are about to be expelled for good... After 7 years, the fandom finally got what it wanted.

...then why do I feel like I’ve actually wasted those 7 years of my life?

Buckle up, ‘cause this is going to be a long ride.

As someone who’s been eagerly awaiting for Lila to be exposed since Volpina, a feeling that only grew with each passing episode she’s been featured in, I honestly find this development wholly underwhelming, highly disappointing, even.

Maybe I’m too vindictive, who knows, but this in no way feels like proper comeuppance for a character who’s been maliciously manipulating everyone around her and relishing in other people’s misery since she was first introduced.

First and foremost, because having Lila accidentally reveal herself while gloating is too much of a cliché. I’ve seen people before mentioning how Lila exposing herself seemed to be the only way this could go, seeing as Marinette’s best attempts always seemed to fail. But if we ignore for a second this was actually set up by Marinette and Sabrina, with the way it’s handled it just feels like a kick in the gut, not the overwhelming catharsis I’m sure most of us were expecting.

Because, and this is actually my main problem with the execution, by having Lila expose herself by spouting a self-satisfied tirade of every single lie she’s ever told and people have believed without question as she disparages Sabrina’s attempts to take her down, saying how she could easily turn everyone against her, the narrative is actually framing Lila in the right.

When we as the audience know it shouldn’t be like that.

Lila only really upped her game in season 5 (and even then the writers still rely too much on the characters being dumbed down around her for it to work), up until then all her lies would have been easily discreditable if the writers didn’t need the class and everyone in Paris to believe her for her schemes to work!

From our perspective, Lila is nowhere near as formidable as she presents herself to be. Which, admittedly, goes in line with her consistent characterisation (about her only consistent trait aside from being hateful and a liar) that she believes and presents herself to be more special than she actually is. But the problem is no character other than Marinette, Adrien, and now Sabrina ever learnt of this fact! Maybe now that she’s exposed herself, but with the way she gloated about all her plans going off without a hitch...

Which leads us to another reason this was the worst possible execution of Lila being exposed they could have come up with:

It was a stroke of luck.

That’s it. That’s unquestionably what it was. Because hadn’t Sabrina finally grown a spine and drawn the line with the actions she was willing to commit for Chloé’s sake, Marinette would have had no way of knowing of Lila’s plan and preparing accordingly.

Really, the only positive thing I can say about it is that it could maybe count as character development for Marinette since she finally learned she needed to be as sneaky as Lila if she wanted to take her down. And there’s of course the fact that Sabrina finally broke away from Chloé. Other than that? It’s a fairly sombre scenario, really.

Because, again, Marinette didn’t manage to finally beat Lila because she had a strong support network (which would have painted a very symbolic and meaningful picture showcasing how, for all the superficial attention her lies can get her, in reality, Lila will always be alone as long as she doesn’t put in the genuine effort to reach out to others like Marinette does), but because she had outside help. Again, help she couldn’t have accounted for until Sabrina herself reached out to her.

Relating to my previous point, Marinette never got Alya to even believe her about Lila or at the very least question how genuine she was until Lila spelled it out for her. Even though she’s known her best friend is Ladybug for months, which brings forth the question if letting Alya in on Marinette’s secret ended up being even worth it if the writers refuse to have her help her out where it matters (I’ll be sure to go back to this point in a minute, just you wait).

What else? Oh, I know! How about the fact that, for a season that was supposed to be all about Adrienette winning, the writers purposely robbed us of that Adrienette vs Lila alliance we were promised back in Chameleon, huh? Because Adrien was completely left out of the plan. In fact, ever since Ladybug back in season 3, he hasn’t been allowed to do anything to help Marinette against Lila. As with the Ladynoir conflict in season 4, his relevance all but vanished even though he was a central part of the conflict from seasons 1-3.

Even better! When he finally spoke up about Lila to Nino and Alya, arguably his best friends besides Ladybug, they completely brushed his concerns off as him just agreeing with Marinette out of boyfriend obligation! I didn’t know intangible things could slap me in the face, but boy was I wrong!

And the best part? This complete disregard of his feelings, lack of communication, and their assuming they know better than him (which disturbingly parallels to his own relationship with Gabriel...) is certainly never going to be explored, let alone resolved.

What do I mean with all this?

Well, basically that for a show that’s supposed to promote the power of love, friendship, and teamwork, when it comes to Lila Marinette is all alone. Has been since Volpina.

But at least that’s done with, Lila got her just desserts, and we’re never going to have to deal with her ever again...

SIGH

Except, not really. Not at all, in fact.

Because just as she and Chloé were finally being reprimanded for their actions, Mr. Damocles had to choose that of all moments to realise he failed as a principal, attract an akuma, cause a racket, and provide Lila with the perfect distraction to just...walk away unscathed.

And with the reveal that she actually has more identities, social circles, and opportunities to lie and manipulate to fall back to after being expelled from the Françoise-Dupont...Let’s just say it implies that while Marinette (and the audience) had to endure nothing short of psychological torture, Lila never really had anything to lose.

Now I ask you...how the Hell am I supposed to consider that a satisfying, cathartic resolution to that particular arc?!?!?!?

And if you permit me, there is one more thing I’d like to get off my chest.

Alya’s reaction to this.

After learning the truth she rushes to hug Marinette and apologise, being a clear wreck about it. And while Marinette getting an apology once in a blue moon is always a welcomed thing, once again the writers aim and completely miss their shot. Because Alya apologises for being gullible.

Look, back in seasons 1 and 2, Hell, even back in season 3, I could have overlooked this. Yes, she never listened to Marinette, could be a tad hypocritical, and the whole jealous thing got old and annoying fast, but at least she couldn’t know for certain Lila was bad news. But from season 4 onwards Alya no longer has such an excuse. No, from season 4 onwards Alya’s problem isn’t that she’s gullible, it’s that she willingly and repeatedly chose to blatantly ignore all of Marinette’s suspicions and warnings regarding Lila. Even after Adrienette finally became canon and Marinette had realistically no reason to feel jealous of Lila in any way, shape or form, Alya still couldn’t fathom that, perhaps, her best friend had her reasons for disliking Lila besides a love triangle.

The moment Alya learned Marinette is Ladybug, the two should have been allowed to talk about Lila, about the real reason Marinette hates her, and to work together to overcome this issue and bring her down. How do you expect me to be okay with season 5 opening to these two having daily sleepovers to talk about Marinette’s love life, but not a single second could be spared after Illusion to have Alya question why Marinette hates her so much, if not connect the dots herself since she is Ladybug’s best friend, not Lila, and Ladybug hates her?

I’ve seen people justify this saying it’s been a long time since Lila lied about being Ladybug’s best friend, and while I’ll argue the last time it was mentioned was actually Chameleon, not Volpina, I could see your point. Except that is not just another lie, like her claiming she knows Jagged Stone or Prince Ali. No, that is the lie that started everything.

It was because Lila lied about knowing Ladybug to impress everyone, especially Adrien, that Marinette completely lost it and chewed her out for it in front of him. It’s because of that lie and the consequent reaction it got from Ladybug that Lila even developed a grudge in the first place. It’s because of that lie that Marinette ever found out about Lila being a liar, because before she first lied to Adrien about being close to Ladybug, Marinette was panicking because she had no chance against someone as incredible as her. If she hadn’t lied about knowing Ladybug, Marinette would have been as fooled by her as everyone else and the two might have never really come to blows.

So don’t tell me it was never brought up because it was so long ago and it doesn’t matter anymore, when that particular lie carries so much weight and we all know the real reason they couldn’t have Alya in Marinette’s corner is because the writers know Lila needs everyone around her to follow her blindly for her lies to work and everything to always work out in her favour because otherwise she just doesn’t work as a villain.

TL;DR: If you want a good resolution to the Lila Gets Exposed plot, pick literally any fanfic dealing with this exact premise. It’ll be better, I promise.

#miraculous ladybug #ml #mlb #ml spoilers #ml season 5 #ml season 5 spoilers #ml s5.21 #confrontation #ml salt #ml analysis #Marinette Dupain-Cheng #sabrina raincomprix #adrien agreste #lila salt #alya salt #lila rossi #alya césaire #chloé bourgeois

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miraculouslbcnreactions · 2 months ago

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Do you think that Ms. Bustier is overhated?

Not particularly. I don't have any strong feelings about her, but she's clearly a terrible teacher who is in way over her head. I totally understand why she sets some people off. If she was a real person that I actually had to deal with, then she'd probably set me off, too, because she so perfectly encapsulates toxic positivity. If you're not familiar with that term, then here's a quick definition:

Toxic positivity is the act of avoiding, suppressing, or rejecting negative emotions or experiences. This may take the form of denying your own emotions or someone else denying your emotions, insisting on positive thinking instead. Although setting aside difficult emotions is sometimes necessary temporarily, denying negative feelings long term is harmful because it can prevent people from processing their emotions and overcoming their distress.

Read that definition and then look at this scene from Zombiezou:

Marinette: But Miss Bustier, it's so not fair! It was Chloé, pulling another...Chloé! And...I'm the one who's getting in trouble?! Miss Bustier: Of course you're not in trouble, don't worry! As the class representative, I want you to set a good example for your classmates. Don't give into feelings of anger. Try to forgive Chloé instead. Marinette: I don't get it... Chloé is the meanest person I've ever known. Miss Bustier: Come on... There are much worse people in Paris right now than Chloé Bourgeois. I'm sure people like Chloé are capable of great things. The problem is, they only think of themselves. They don't understand the meaning of love, and we can't force them to change. But perhaps we can show them by setting a good example. That's why Marinettes are so important in today's world; because they have a lot of love to give. I'm counting on you. Marinette: Yes, Miss Bustier.

This is toxic positivity in action. Marinette is told to set aside her extremely valid feelings as if anger is a terrible thing, but it isn't. All emotions have their place and ignoring them can do real harm, a lesson that Miraculous really struggles with. It seems to see "negative" emotions as bad and they're really not. What matters is how we express and address our emotions, not that we experience them. If you want to see a family friendly piece of media do this topic right, then go watch Pixar's Inside Out.

There's also the fact that Chloé is never punished for her actions in this episode. She ruined a gift that probably took Marinette hours and yet Miss Bustier puts the onus to fix things on Marinette, blaming the victim and doing nothing to actually fix the situation. Canon mildly complicates this with Chloé's father's willingness to meddle, making punishing her apparently impossible, but Miss Bustier doesn't even acknowledge that here. The stated logic is that you need to be nice to your bully and that will hopefully magically fix things, which is a terrible lesson that I don't want any kid to learn! What kind of logic is that?

I'll admit that I'm a big fan of "an eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind," but that doesn't mean that you should never acknowledge harm or fight back. It just means that you need to be measured in your responses and pick your battles wisely. If this episode was about that, then I'd be fine with it, but that's not the lesson here. There is no point where the wrong done to Marinette is even mildly acknowledged. Miss Bustier's initial reaction to seeing Marinette's ruined gift is:

Miss Bustier: Well, I think this present is wonderful. It'll be my new cosmetics bag! Then I'll be able to think of both of you every time I use it.

And we go straight from that to the toxic positivity.

Something is wrong with this woman. You shouldn't even take this approach with preschoolers! While I could see this being a good final solution to something like Chloé scribbling on Marinette's drawing, Chloé's behavior still needs to be addressed. She is still the one in the wrong here. The one whose behavior needs to change.

This is one of many cases where there are two paths to take with this character. The writers clearly want Miss Bustier to be a wonderful teacher, but they wrote a victim-blaming disaster who shouldn't be in charge of anyone. If you're ever adapting her, then it's up to you if you want to redesign her into her intended self or if you want to lean into the bad writing. I think both paths have merit because the writing is so bad that there is no way to make canon Caline work as a good teacher. She's too fundamentally flawed so you either acknowledge how awful she is or do a major overhaul where she's much less forgiving and actually acknowledges things like the Chloé problem.

#justsomedumbrussianteenageboy #ml's wacky morals #Caline Bustier salt #ml writing critical #ml writing salt

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ilikekidsshows · 24 days ago

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Often I see "Any time Adrien feels awful the writers put Marinette through the emotional wringer so he puts his needs aside to help her" used to explain what is happening in the show, but tbh, I wouldn't call that entirely accurate

What happens is that Marinette cries louder and in more destructive ways, that doesn't make what she goes through worse. Marinette by now becomes an emotional wreck any moment she feels discomfort or is challenged in some way.

Just because she always has huge reactions to anything that doesn't go her way doesn't it mean it's actually THAT bad when you put it into perspective with other characters.

That's what I already felt was the case in season 4. The amount of times Marinette lost her mind at any little challenge she faced made her rather seem like a questionable protagonists since her priorities never lead to anything worthwhile. They just have her panic as a cheap way to have her brute force her way through the narrative because that's supposed to excuse all the victims of her actions and behaviour.

But having her 24/7 panic and cry is just not enough to change the fact that most of her "problems" aren't real problems, they just always have her go about everything in the worst possible way and then story blames everyone else for her shit priorities.

Yes, she had no guidance, but 1) Suhan was yet another character girlbossed into submission bc he wasn't allowed to have any point whatsoever cause "how else can Marinette be the true Queen of the Miraculous?". Doesn't mean he wasn't THERE. Adrien in Furious Fu even asked Suhan to fucking HELP them with his experience, that's more willingness to be reasonable about the guardian situation and learn than Marinette EVER was. It was her either entirely HER way or entirely SUHANS way.

And 2) does she need to have her hand held that much that she cant be expected to know that making any kind of effort to FIND Hawkmoth is more important than making her useless team of yes men? but I guess we all know why they had her prioritize the yes men.

If Marinette really is so emotionally instable and confused that she can't possibly be asked to do her job and look for the villain she was chosen to defeat then how is that not clear proof that Marinette is a shit guardian choice. Ironically, if Suhan had actually taken LB's and CN's Miraculous and the Miracle Box and given them to adults, then the new heros might have even CARED to end this fight.

In hindsight, pretty much everything reflects even worse on Marinette when it already didn't look too well for her in season 4. But damn, Marinette is all around a pretty fatal failure. The team was a waste of time, all the privileges Alya got on Adrien's expense proved themselves entirely wasted on her in season 5 too (dgmw, I truly like her, but that's just objectively the case. Everything Alya got that Cat Noir got denied was entirely wasted on her), Marinette never even tried finding Hawkmoth and only did so when Feligami did her entire job and made it possible for her to be present in the finale herself that hurt the entire word's population bc our main character put any little problem in her life before ever caring about the villain she was supposed to defeat.

If Kagami hadn't made Felix tell Marinette, Marinette would have spend the finale crying in her bed bc her boyfriend is gone. I always thought it was too harsh to say that Marinette is a badly chosen protagonist, but the show itself sure made that statement true. She just doesn't care about anything tat ever happens beyond how it affects herself. So we got nowhere.

---

I think this is a case of “how it started” versus “how it's going”, although the underlining theme of “Marinette cries harder over smaller problems than other characters have” has been there since the start. Like, I’m pretty sure I’ve said that almost word-for-word, I started off viewing Marinette’s emotional breakdowns as more justified, until I started to notice how many cases were just her blubbering because she was caught up in her own mistakes. Like, the New York Special and season four finale are understandable, she went through some shit anyone would need a cry over there. The problem was that even then Cat Noir also had justified or even bigger reasons to be upset, but he was forced to be fine for Marinette's sake but the same is never asked from Marinette. In addition, once I actually forced myself to watch the NY special again, I realized that, between “collateral damage in Paris she can't fix” and “Adrien has to leave a school trip early”, the school trip thing is the thing she cries about the hardest. Our heroine cares more about not seeing her crush for a few days than the supposed failure that made her turn her back on her partner.

That made me realize that it really was all about Marinette's own screwed up priorities. It's all about her love quest with only the minimum consideration given to her duties as a superhero and the Guardian of the Miraculous. Like, every time she makes some kind of effort in superheroics, it's way too late into the game and almost always some kind of nonsense that brings her no closer to actually stopping Hawk Moth. Like, she tracks where Akumas show up as late as season 5, when we already know Hawk Moth’s pattern by heart by then. Also the fucking Miraculous trick box she tinkered with and showed off that then ended up being pointless because she made it so convoluted she decided to put the Miraculouses up in cloud to make calling backup heroes easier. Making Alya her confidant led to more time being spent on making sure that Alya doesn't do anything Marinette doesn't approve than doing anything useful in the long term

Félix and Kagami told her who Hawk Moth was and she did nothing with that info. She wasn't worried about what this would mean for Adrien, she was only worried that Gabriel was against their romantic relationship. Maybe, if Marinette had spared a single thought to her heroic duty outside of what's right in front of her nose, she wouldn't have had to quickly decide what to do and might not have ended up covering for Gabriel and feeling so bad about it. Like, I already know our protagonist can't be arsed to think about others, but she could have made things easier for herself, at least.

The only contest Marinette is winning is the Who Can Cry the Hardest contest. She's a fucking champ at blowing things out of proportion.

#ml critical #ml salt #dats chats

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baenyth · 3 months ago

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Bethany's Bizarre Miraculous Rewrite: The Romance Subplot for the Planned Seasons

One of my goals for my rewrite is to make the romance subplot of the series less drawn-out, more cathartic, feature more of the side ships of Lukanette, Adrigami, and even Marichat, and also get more gay. So without further ado, here's the romance subplot for the first five seasons:

Season 1 (Equivalent to seasons 1 and 2, twice the length of a normal season): Basic lovesquare antics. Marinette loves Adrien, but not Chat Noir. Adrien loves Ladybug, but not Marinette. They're also both fucked-up. Marinette knows Adrien's schedule and far too many personal details about him. Adrien as Chat acts entitled to Ladybug's love and even causes an akuma with his entitlement. He does get raked over the coals for that and after Glaciator/the Ice Cream akuma becomes far more respectful towards Ladybug, but still harbors love for her. He starts to move on from her after Frozer/the Ice Skating akuma, however.

Season 2 (Equivalent to season 3): The love square reversal happens a few episodes in. Yes, really. Adrien gets over Ladybug in favor of Marinette, while Marinette tries to put her feelings of Adrien aside to prove to her class that she isn't just jealous of Lila and targets Chat Noir instead. She does act salty at Kagami for a few episodes, however. During the kwamiswap Lady Noire is utterly down bad for Mister Bug as they fight All Eyes on Mecha. Desperada's arc of Ladybug picking Adrien in favor of Luka is replaced with picking Chat in favor of Luka. The season 5 episode where Marinette and Chat Noir go on a date and gets the ice cream man akumatized occurs here. Alya has doubts about Marinette's crush. She's right, and eventually Marinette realizes that and goes back to Adrien. Since the two are in love with eachother, things work out quickly and easily and they get together and kiss by the season finale.

Season 3 (Equivalent to seasons 3 and 4): On the first episode of Season 3 Adrienette has a horrific messy breakup after Adrien discovers the Schedule and similar things. I was thinking of putting it four episodes in, but I decided 1. it would be better if it was the beginning of the season and 2. I want Adrienette fans to feel the same despair I felt as a Lukanette and Adrigami fan at the start of season 4. The rest of the season focuses on the aftermath of this nightmare breakup. Ladybug and Chat Noir comfort and give advice to each other about the breakup and coalesce into a queerplatonic couple. They still don't figure out their identities because they're dumb teens. Marinette and Adrien start dating Luka and Kagami respectively halfway through the season and their relationships get plenty of time to shine. Marinette genuinely falls in love with Luka. Same with Adrien and Kagami. The love square is dead. Good riddance. Thankfully, Marinette does apologize to Adrien, and they make up and become just friends.

Season 4 (Equivalent to season 4): Here's some context: in the Season 3 finale, Hawkmoth was finally defeated but not Coeur, the woman behind Hawkmoth. What's worse is 1. Master Fu had to abdicate guardianship to Ladybug and 2. Coeur managed to discover multiple hero identities. So now Ladybug is working overtime creating guardian potions and doing nightly patrols to check up on everyone who got exposed. She's getting stressed, she's burning herself out, and so her parents start helping her with her guardian duties (they've known since season 1,) giving Ladybug a support group that she's not telling Chat Noir about. And kittycat's getting suspicious. He knows Ladybug's not telling him information and in general he feels like he's on the level of the side heroes rather than one of the main two, causing relationship troubles in their queerplatonic couple. Chat Noir starts training to compensate for this, to the point where he awakening his fullest Miraculous powers (infinite cataclysms!). All of this hard work for both of them causes strain in their civilian relationships, and they unfortunately have to break up because of it and because they can't tell Luka/Kagami their secret identities. And then Luka accidentally finds out both heroes' identities while Kagami manages to figure them out on her own. As for the stuff between Ladybug and Chat Noir, it gets resolved by Cat Walker, although here Ladybug is more unnerved by Cat Walker, and she apologizes to Chat Noir and lets him as much in the loop as she can without compromising her identity.

Season 5 (Equivalent to season 5 except not really): Ladybug and Chat Noir are back as a queerplatonic couple, baby! The two of them against the world! And also the other heroes! The fun parts come from their civilian relationships. Luka and Kagami, now that they know our heroes' identities, start dating them again, but the other way around. Lukadrien and Marigami. These relationships are arguably better than the other ones, too. Luka and Adrien share so much in common that they really get eachother, while Marinette is more comfortable with her sexuality and has a girlfriend that pushes her to be more, and Kagami has a loving relationship with little-to-no secrets! Rose is ecstatic. Tomoe is pissed because no Adrigami. Also, at the end of the season, after Coeur fucking dies and Felix, her last minion, is arrested for being a butt, we finally get an identity reveal between Ladybug and Chat Noir! And if this ends up as the series finale, Lukadrien and Marigami converge into the polycule of the gods, Lukadrigaminette!

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theerurishipper · 1 year ago

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This is just an unstructured, incoherent vent post, but I've seen a few posts recently about how Adrien would definitely forgive Marinette for keeping secrets from him because he loves her, or that he would blame himself for not noticing what was going on and not her. And those aren't wrong, per se, but this is what I mean by the show taking away Adrien's agency. Ultimately his choices are allowed only as far as they do not inconvenience Marinette or anyone else the narrative cares about, like Felix or Nathalie. Which is why Adrien is not allowed to grow, he is not allowed to prioritize his own feelings and emotional needs. Any wrong done to him is resolved by him putting aside his own feelings to forgive the people who wronged him. And yes, he has been taught that his feelings don't matter by Gabriel and that he should bend over to the whims of everybody around him. And that kind of makes it worse, how the effect of Gabriel's abuse is used to convenience everyone around him. I think it's gross.

Just look at the Ladynoir conflict from Season 4. Adrien brings up his grievances with Ladybug's treatment of him a few times, but ultimately, he ends up putting it aside to focus on her emotional needs when she is at her lowest. Kuro Neko gave us the message that it wasn't that Ladybug was treating Chat Noir unfairly, but that Chat Noir should stop expecting to be treated with respect and should stop having emotional needs. And at the end of Strikeback, nothing is resolved, Ladybug hasn't apologized to him or resolved to do better by him, but he still shows up to her side to comfort her. No, she didn't apologize to him. She admitted her mistakes but did little to correct them even after the fact. That whole arc ended with Chat Noir being treated poorly over and over, and yet coming back to Ladybug's side because he's such a good partner and he loves her so much.

And Adrien, a character who has been forced his whole life to bend to the whims of others to please them at his expense is doing the same thing to Ladybug. Adrien exhibiting this behavior is 100% a trauma response. Ladybug is supposed to be his escape from his abusive homelife. And yet, the show writes him falling back into his trauma responses with her (Kuro Neko) and does jack shit to portray it as a bad thing. And the Season 4 finale is once again Adrien putting aside his feelings and showing up to support her. Adrien's emotions are not validated, they are tossed aside. Ladybug admitted her mistakes as she did several times through Season 4, but she still did little to correct them. That admission in Strikeback doesn't do much, because we never see her do anything to fix her mistakes after that. What happened was that Chat Noir saw her in distress and decided his feelings were unimportant because she needed support.

This is not healthy. Adrien should not be invalidating his own feelings so that he can offer comfort to others. He shouldn't forget and forgive so quickly without the other person doing anything to correct their behavior towards him. Once again, this is how Gabriel has taught him to behave, to stop "being so emotional" and to conform to his expectations. And Adrien continuously downplays his own issues for others' sake. And obviously, we would understand that he can heal from this, that he can learn to take care of his own emotional needs first.

And quite frankly, all the posts about how we shouldn't want Adrien and Marinette to break up, or how we shouldn't be so hard on Marinette, or that she is just a child in tough situation, or that she is doing it out of love and that Adrien would forgive her kinda make my point. Because let's be real. What Marinette did is a serious breach of trust. I do not understand how anyone could forgive something like that quickly. And I understand why she did it. I don't think she is a bad person or anything like that. But it's still an awful thing to do. And frankly, I don't see how Adrien could just... instantaneously forgive her without invalidating and downplaying his own pain and hurt. If he did, I would seriously question his self-worth. And while I don't think Adrien would never forgive Marinette or that he would stop loving her, frankly, I would like to see more acknowledgement of his feelings and his emotional needs both from the fandom and the show. I would like to see that his feelings matter, that he is allowed to be angry and that he is allowed to hold people accountable and call them out. I would like for him to not forgive some people. I would like for him to require distance and space from them. That would be development for Adrien, to let himself be emotional and not feel the need to put his own needs aside for others.

But for Adrien to prioritize himself, it would mean acknowledging the harmful things characters like Marinette have done to him. And that can't happen, because all the purpose Adrien serves is as a plot device to connect Marinette to Gabriel, and actually having her be held accountable by the narrative for her choices is a big no no. Growth for Adrien would mean that he lets himself be angry at Marinette for how she kept secrets from him, never apologized for it, and ultimately ended up keeping the greatest secret of all from him about his father and the fact that he is a Sentimonster. But as the writing to this point shows, Marinette isn't a safe space for him where he is allowed to be himself. She is someone who also elicits his trauma responses from him. He doesn't let himself be angry with her, he always puts himself last when it comes to her.

I am not saying Marinette is in any way comparable to Gabriel. She is nowhere as bad as him, she does not come close to that in any way. Marinette is a good person. But what she did in the finale, is explicitly something that Gabriel wanted her to do. Gabriel wanted to continue to dictate his son's emotions and perceptions, and Marinette helped him do it. That's not a healthy relationship. And looking at all the Marinette-Gabriel parallels in Season 5... it's not a good look at all. The show portrays Adrien as someone who has been denied autonomy his whole life, and as someone who is expected to cater to the desires of the people around him and be perfect for them while neglecting his emotional needs, and made his arc one of finding independence and his own identity and learning that his feelings and desires matter. But also, they only matter as far as they don't inconvenience Marinette. Adrien shouldn't downplay his feelings, but if doing so would help Marinette, then he should do it actually. And it's hard for me not to see it as Ladybug benefitting from his trauma from his abusive home. It sounds harsh, but that's how it feels.

And all the talk of how Adrien would never hate Marinette and that he would forgive her is... disappointing to me. Because I don't necessarily disagree, but it still is about prioritizing Marinette's feelings over Adrien's. What is focused on is not how Adrien might feel betrayed, but how Marinette might feel sad about Adrien feeling betrayed by her, and reinforces that Adrien is so good because he would not hold it against her. Even though he should, even though it means he would be downplaying his pain massively if he didn't blame her for that. If Adrien's character should develop, he should be allowed to realize that he has the right to get angry and that he doesn't have to downplay his emotions or feel like it's all his fault. He should be allowed to do that without people jumping to Marinette's defense and excusing her of blame.

Throughout the series, Adrien has been the person to help Ladybug through her problems, and the narrative has never allowed her to do the same for him. And I want to see focus on Adrien for a change. I want to see someone other than Plagg reassuring him and supporting him, especially his partner. I want to see the narrative be less about "oh, Adrien would never hold anything against Marinette because he loves her and would understand her always," and be more "actually Adrien is allowed to prioritize his feelings and want distance from Marinette after she betrayed him in such a personal way." That would be development. That would be reclaiming his agency. That would be free will and autonomy. I would like to see focus on this in the show and the fandom.

Adrien is not obligated to forgive Marinette. He is not obligated to understand her reasonings for why she did what she did. He is allowed to be angry at her and express his hurt because of her actions. Seasons 4 and 5 have regrettably established Marinette as someone else who denies Adrien's agency and around whom he reverts back to his fawning trauma response, and quite frankly the best thing for him to do would be to break up with her and go find himself on his own terms. I want his character to develop and grow, and unfortunately, Seasons 4 and 5 proved to me that it would not be possible as long as he is around Marinette, both from a character and narrative standpoint.

I just wish people would acknowledge and validate Adrien's perspective and feelings more. Even if it means calling out Marinette. Gabe is Adrien's abuser but he isn't the only one who has hurt Adrien in the story. Marinette is an incredible and amazing person but as far as we've reached in the show, she is hurting Adrien. And she has done many things across these two seasons that violate Adrien's trust. It's not even that this is a mistake she could learn from, but that she has done several such things over and over. From keeping secrets about the Miraculous holders' identities even though Hawkmoth himself knew, to Rena Furtive, to trying to trick him into an identity reveal in Ephemeral, and now keeping the fact that he is a Sentimonster and that Gabe is Monarch from him. It's gone from secret keeping to outright lying to him. It is not healthy. And it is a sign of stagnation and regression in Adrien's growth if he continues to keep forgiving her over and over again despite her never fixing her behavior.

If Adrien's arc is about finding autonomy, then he cannot be with someone who is complicit in denying him the ability to make his own choices. If Marinette was supposed to be the knight in shining armor, they shouldn't have given her the key to the tower and have her hide it away. If she was supposed to save him, they shouldn't have had her condemn him further. If Marinette was supposed to be the one who helped Adrien regain his self worth, the person whom he could trust and rely on the most, they shouldn't have made her side with Gabe, deny Adrien his agency, and violate his trust so many times.

It didn't have to be written this way, but these were the decisions made by the writers. They chose to portray Marinette like this for no discernable reason and refused to acknowledge it or deal with it meaningfully. Adrienette is so profoundly unhealthy now that if Adrien's character is to grow, the only way for him to do that is to break up with Marinette. But the show has also made it very clear that Adrien is only a plot device and a trophy for Marinette at the end. So I have no doubt that all will be forgiven in a matter of minutes, and the narrative will praise Adrien for being traumatized and denying his own emotional needs to comfort Marinette as she feels bad for hurting him. And it's sad, but I guess it is what it is.

#MLB #Meta #My meta #S5 Finale #ML Salt #ML Writing Salt #ML Fandom Salt #Marinette Salt #Not really but tagging to be safe #Ladynoir conflict

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immaturityofthomasastruc · 11 months ago

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I can see the inconsistency of Felix character is because he actually a character for there "Fans demand" :

Sooo you prefer 2D-Catnoir/Felix rather than our angel Adrien ? Here Felix ! He official debut in "Felix" ! He is Adrien cousin and a big jerk ! Hate him just like how I hate him too !

Wh- What ? You like him ? Fuck ! So you feel he is more competent that our pure evulz bitch teenagers ? Fine ! Here's Felix who manage to trick Gabriel in "Gabriel Agreste" ! Now He is as dangerous as Gabe

Oh Fuck ! You still like him and feel he is more "relevant" than our angel Adrien and my sweetie Marinette ? Here's I present YOU Felix join Miracuclass as "Dog Hero" and then sell all the Miraclouses to Gabe ! He is Evil ! EVil ! EVIIIIL !

What ? You asking me why he want Peacock Miraculous so much ?! Here I present you Felix as Argos ! He wiped humanity out-of-spite and try to create the Utopia for his own freedom ! He is misanthrope !

What A second ? Why... You... STILL.... EXPECTED... CHLOE... TO BE REDEEMED.... why she already... has many traits... to be put in "Complete Monster" territory ? Why YOU keep want her to be redeem like Zuzu and Pacifica just because having shitty parents ? FINE ! Here's Felix to be our Zuzu ! He is tragic little peacock... has tragic backstory.... shitty dad... and a handsome teenager.... pretty much like Zuzu right ? Now shut up and Go simp on him and Feligami already !

Proper redemption arc ? Who hell need redemption arc as long as he is "tragic and handsome" ? Don't worry... we will make Kagami as "senti" out-of-nowhere aside she wear different ring as excuse and a "horny possessive girl" who still can't move on from Adrien and make her Simp felix because he smell and looks like Adrien RIIIIIIIIIIIGHHT LOL

Honestly, it is pretty hilarious that Felix was meant to be seen as the actual character who went through a serious redemption arc compared to Chloe, when the writers pretty much speedran through every major part of it in time for the finale.

Like, say what you will about Chloe and whether or not you think she deserved to be redeemed, but at least the arc leading to her betrayal was spread across three seasons. Felix's redemption arc only lasted three episodes.

Because of the poor pacing, this is the character journey Felix goes through during the latter half of Season 5.

Emotion: "I'm going to wipe out all of humanity and create a better world! Wait, you think I'm insane for erasing your friends and family from existance while essentially committing mass genocide? WHAT HAVE I DONE?!"

Pretension: "Even though I've spent almost no time with you, I think I'm falling in love with you because you may be a Sentimonster person with strict parents like me. Of course, I don't love you enough to break my new moral code against using Sentimonsters or even answering for my betrayal of Ladybug."

Representation: "I'm finally going to do something to help Ladybug because her arch-enemy is getting in the way with my week-old relationship, and that moral code against Sentimonsters? I don't want to use Sentimonsters to fight, but using Sentimonsters to put on a play to convey information I could easily tell Ladybug myself, since my new girlfriend conviently learned her identity over ten episodes ago? Perfectly okay. And since I have a personal stake by wanting to protect both my cousin and girlfriend, surely, this means I'll get to play a big part in the season finale instead of just letting Ladybug do all the work, right?"

Conformation and Re-Creation:

#immaturity of thomas astruc #iota #miraculous ladybug #miraculous ladybug salt #felix graham de vanily #argos #marinette dupain cheng #ladybug #chloe bourgeois #queen bee #queen b

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blueberrypancakesworld · 1 year ago

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What if ? - Adrien becoming a big brother

warning : angst, fluff, hurt/comfort, no use of Y/n

Gabriel Agreste x fem!reader

Info : So I needed to wrote another idea of @iamallthingsasian of what could have been when Betterfly's wife (adriens stepmother) got pregnant. Have fun reading this little thing ;)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

°What could be?

°It could have been that in one of the many parallel universes Adrien was not an only child. That his father, who found hope and love in Hesperia or Betterfly, and his two former enemies Shadybug and Clawnoir, the latter being his own son Adrien, found hope and became good.

°They all saw hope and love in a new future Adrien with his Marinette finally came together and his father eventually found love. A stroke of fate that the blonde could not immediately cope with. He fled to his girlfriend and the two together in drawings, music and concerts tried to process the fear that they felt.

°But after Adrien realized how happy his father was with his new girlfriend. How kind she was to Gabriel, Nathalie, Marinette and himself, his resentment against her had slowly subsided and together they were all the good that now fought against evil.

°A team that one year later had a message to announce. Adrien would have a half-sister and become a big brother. Is it true?" murmured the blond, looking at the ultrasound image as they sat together at the table. Gabriel nodded and Y/n put a hand on her belly.

°Yet you couldn't see anything, but in a few months you would start to see something. They both feared that Adrien would get angry or even run away. The reaction was understandable. To their surprise and relief, the blond stood up and hugged his parents. He had finally taken his stepmother more than just into his heart.

°The family would grow before a little girl was born months later. ,,Adrien your little sister Emelie" said Gabriel and stepped aside. He put a hand on his son's shoulder before Adrien saw his sister in his stepmother's arms. The little baby looked at him curiously and gurgled before taking a finger from him.

°,,Emelie...like mother" he said and his voice became brittle Marinette took his hand and Gabrielle put a hand on his shoulder and stroked his head. The family seemed to have finally found peace...at least in this universe.

°But they wanted to share the happiness with Ladybug and Catnoir from the other universe. They traveled there with the help of Alyas and had a meeting. Ladybug was completely enraptured by little Emelie and Gabriel held his wife supportively while Adrien held the baby. ,,Emelie...she's so cute...you're lucky" the only child murmured and his friend held his hand. Before he gave the baby back to its mother and she rocked it slightly.

°They all knew about the pain, the mistreatment of his father and fine Hawkmoth. They knew that Adrien was suffering until Hesperia had an idea. ,,How about we visit more often and train together and you could see Emelie" he suggested and saw the blond's look turn from disbelief to gratitude.

°He fell into his "father's" arms and stroked the baby's head one last time, knowing that in this pain he was feeling there was also hope.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

#miraculous world #miraculous ladybug #miraculoustalesofladybugandcatnoir #gabriel agreste #hesperia #betterfly #hesperia x reader #gabriel agreste x reader #cat noir #claw noir #shadybug #ladybug and chat noir

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awakefor48hours · 7 months ago

Note

Do you have any LGBTQ+ black clover headcanons? Talk about them!

I sure do have LGBT+ headcanons for Black Clover characters so let's go over them.

Black Bulls

Vanessa - Bisexual

I headcanon Vanessa as bi (leans more towards women) because her backstory feels very similar to a queer allegory.

Vanessa is has pink hair and pronouns, grew up with a strict maternal figure (who does have Catholic imagery), who forbade her from having relationships with people of a certain gender. Then as soon as she leaves and finally joins the outside world, she starts to dress in more revealing clothes and drinks a lot.

All of that together, it just feels very similar to the way that people who have grown up with overly religious and strict parents behave when they leave to go to college.

Also this haircut

The certified bisexual haircut.

Finral - Bisexual

I headcanon Finral as bi (leans more to women) for pretty similar reasons to Vanessa. They're parallels to each other after all, older siblings to abusive parents that didn't treat them right only to leave to help themselves while also choosing to be the older sibling that the Black Bulls deserve.

He also reminds me of my bi friends, he does finger guns a lot, and is very comfortable when it comes to complimenting men.

Magna - Bisexual

I ship magluck so my opinion is definitely going to be skewed but I fully think he's bi (no gender preference). The way he talks about being a man and masculinity, it just feels like a bit more than just appreciation, to me at least.

Luck - Pansexual

Like with Magna, my opinion on this is skewed because I ship magluck but I headcanon Luck as pan (no gender preference). His design is nearly the pan flag (just missing the pink) and he hasn't shown any real preference to anyone when it comes to forming a romantic and/or sexual relationship. When it comes to Luck's relationship with dating, it's a bit muddy because he's never been shown to be explicitly in love with anyone but from what we've seen he's not against dating women and the only person he's blushed around was Magna. Also when the Black Bulls share the type of people they like, Luck doesn't specify his preferred partner by gender (source: chapter 103).

As you can see, save for Gordon, everyone else uses gendered terms (or just say the person's name) to describe their preferred partner, expect for Luck.

I will say, I do know that when the captains answer, they use more gendered neutral terms (source: chapter 167)

but here's the fun thing about fanon, I can pick and chose when I want to stick my fingers in ears and go "lalalalalalalala! I can't hear you!"

Noelle - Biromantic/Asexual

This is a headcanon that's a bit skewed because Noelle reminds me a lot of Marinette from ML so I share a lot of headcanons between them. Putting that aside Noelle is bi (leans more to men)/ace (sex neutral).

First of all, I'd like to look at her upbringing. Even though it doesn't seem like homophobia exists in the BC universe (basing this off of the devil worshiper arc) I wouldn't put it past the royals to be queerphobic or have amanormative/heteronormative views.

With that in mind, it wouldn't be too strange to believe that Noelle would pick up some comphet beliefs. She definitely like Asta but I also feel like her relationship with Kahono is also a bit romantic.

Let's also not forget that Noelle has a hard time with her emotions, Kahono even notes this herself. (Source: chapter 103)

With that, I think that she struggles to understand her romantic feelings so it makes sense to me that she wouldn't realize that she does like girls.

I headcanon her as asexual because when it comes to being physical, Noelle seems a bit finicky, in a word. We see that does like intimacy but when it comes to Asta, her love interest, grabbing her or any time of physical contact, suddenly she's very uncomfortable and it just feels pretty asexual.

Grey - Genderfluid

When it comes to shape shifters, I pretty much always headcanon them as genderfluid or trans and Grey is no exception.

Throughout most of her time in the Black Bulls, everyone saw her as a man. She chose to present herself as a man an never corrected anyone when they used he/him pronouns for her, it was also the form she was more comfortable with. She also doesn't seem too uncomfortable when she's presenting as anyone, male or female.

Also, it's no secret that Grey's backstory is based on Cinderella and I once saw a tumblr thread talk about how Cinderella being trans ties the story together (points such as, the slipper only fitting on her foot, the reason why the prince charming didn't even know she existed, it's also why her step mother hated her a lot, etc) and since that stuck with me, I ended up seeing Grey in a similar way.

Nero - Aromantic/Heterosexual

When it comes to Nero's relationships with other people she is a bit closed off, especially since she was a royal that lost her status early on in life. Then you look at her relationship with Lumiere and their relationship never really felt romantic. It was emotional, they were together, but it wasn't romantic at all, to me at least. Then you have the times when she was a bird. I don't ship Asta and Nero but it does seem like she prefers physical relationships than emotional relationships seeing as how she liked Asta the most and was always found on his head.

Nacht - Aro/Ace

Can't get into this too much without dipping into the manga so I'm just gonna say ✨vibes✨

Golden Dawn

Yuno - Aro/Ace

I headcanon Yuno as romance-neutral aromantic/sex repulsed asexual. I feel that Tabata wrote Yuno to be aromantic-spec and/or asexual-spec because Yuno absolutely does not vibe with sexual or romantic relationships in the slightest.

He's called handsome by everyone around him, the male and female characters, and has tons of girls flaunting over him. In fact, in universe, he is literally the hottest guy (source: chapter 105)

Despite everything playing in Yuno's favor to have a romantic partner, he doesn't bat an eye to anyone ever nor does he have a single major character as a love interest.

(I know that Charmy technically has a crush on him but I personally refuse to acknowledge it because as someone who's been both 15 and 19, it makes me very uncomfortable that Charmy was 19 when she fell in love with a whole ass 15 year old.)

Additionally, he just seems so uninterested in any type of physical/sexual relationship and I think the biggest example of this comes from the hot springs arc. even though Yami got all the men hyped up to peep at the women, Yuno could not be more unbothered by the idea. Just look at him. (Source: Chapter 111)

This kid would not care about peeping if his life depended on it. He says that he's "not this kind of character" (which feels like a way of explaining asexuality without knowing the exact wording for it) and Asta even adds onto this by saying that Yuno has been this way since birth. With all of that I just really cannot help but think of Yuno as an asexual or ace-spec.

When you combine his complete disinterest in romance and in anything sexual, it really feels like he's supposed to be somewhere on the aro or ace spectrum. If he's not, he is in my mind.

Mimosa - Lesbian

I know I'm like one of three people to headcanon Mimosa as a lesbian but hear me out. Yes in canon she has a crush on Asta but in my fanon, she's comphet.

This is my headcanon for a few reasons. First of all, like Noelle, Mimosa grew up basically in the household with the same expectations put on them. So as mentioned with Noelle, I wouldn't put it past the royals to have queerphobic beliefs.

Also, Mimosa is an airhead. When it comes to other people's emotions, she cannot understand them to save her life. This is the main reason why Noelle had a hard time seeing her when Mimosa in the dungeon arc. If she's this bad with emotions, it's not hard to believe she would struggle to navigate her own emotions.

Then that takes us to her crush on Asta and I'm still holding onto the comphet lesbian headcanon. Mimosa is trying to go through life her own way, this is why she's in Golden Dawn and not the Crimson Lions, meaning I wouldn't put it past her that this is the first time ever she's really interacted with people outside of her family.

At the end of the dungeon arc, Asta happily smiled and thanked Mimosa for what she did. That was the moment Mimosa fell for him but due to my headcanons/warped perception of the show, I don't see it that way. Even if she was straight, it just feels very comphet to fall for the first boy outside of your family that was nice to you more than once (it's important to remember that Klaus kinda sucked at this time and that Yuno struggles to show affection). In fact, I've personally experienced this and have siblings who've also been there.

Also here's the difference between how Mimosa looked at Asta, after falling for him, and Lolopechka dressed as a queen.

She is just taken aback completely by Lolopechka's beauty but when it comes to Asta, she's just timid. All the moments when Mimosa is blushing around Asta, to my heavily biased POV, it feels more performative than actual attraction.

To even bring Yuno into this, Mimosa hasn't developed feelings for him at all. Throughout the whole series, girls are constantly throwing themselves at Yuno's feet to get his attention and is, once again, he is the most attractive male character in Black Clover. Despite this, Mimosa, the girl who is constantly near him, gets to see him when he's vulnerable, just doesn't develop even a twinge of romantic feelings towards him. She sees him as only a friend.

Lastly, I feel like Mimosa being a lesbian works well with her crush on Asta because it's pretty obvious it's not gonna work out in the end. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that Astelle is going to be canon and when that happens, I think Mimosa taking time to separate her feelings from Asta and move on is something I think is bound to happen, if that happens, I think it'd be really cool if while she's sorting through feelings, she comes to a lesbian realization and pursues relationships with other people, (if I had to be honest, I'd say Rebecca because then you'd have two girls who were heartbroken by the same guy, bonding over that, getting together in the end, and Rebecca finally gets to live a life where she doesn't have to worry about money.)

Alecdora - Gay

This man is madly in love with William with bad coping mechanisms for it, and I refuse to hear anything about it. Fellas, is it gay to devote your entire life to a man to the point that when his attention is diverted to someone else, just a little bit, it gives you so much anxiety that you lose weight because it?

Crimson Lions

Fuegoleon - Bigender

This literally has nothing to do with anything Fuegoleon has done in canon, the reason why I headcanon him as bigender comes from this thread and I wasn't able to stop myself from seeing him as bigender. I think about it so much that I genuinely forget at times that's he's not bigender in canon.

Mereoleona - Lesbian

Originally, this did just start from ✨vibes✨and the fact that she does fall kinda fall into the cliche of lesbians that live alone and scare off the men in their lives. Then Sword of the Wizard King came out and that solidified the lesbian Mereoleona headcanon to me.

I know that Mereoleona said her preferred partner was a "man" but once again, this is fanon so my fingers are in my ears. When it comes to Mereoleona's romantic/sexual life, the one and only character I can see her working with is Princia, Mereoleona did mention she wanted a partner that wouldn't die in mortal combat and Princia didn't. In fact, they were evenly matched, and they're sun and moon coded (methinks soulmates).

I also started shipping them because I'm me but can you really blame me this time? Mereoleona and Princia had a fight in which they very physical with each other, had their clothes get constantly torn off, and kept asking to keep going at it for another round. I feel like I'm describing a fanfiction but I'm just describing what happened on screen.

She's never really had this relationship with anyone else. Everyone, even Yami, is scared of her. So to have a partner that's able to not only handle her energy but able to dish it back to her just feels fitting.

Grey/Aqua Deers

Rill - Asexual

Part of this comes from the fact that I've never met a single cishet artist in my life. Every artist I've ever known has been queer in one way or another.

But to actually look at his character, Rill just seems completely uninterested in any sexual relationships. His one and only romance blossomed when Charmy kicked his ass and it feels a lot like he's admiring her beauty and strength but not in a sexual way.

Blue Rose Knights

Sol - Lesbian

She pretty much fits the lesbian stereotype to a T

Princia - Lesbian

Along with a lot of the reasons that I headcanon Mereoleona as a lesbian and she did become the captain of an all girl squad so I'm already doubting any straight behavior.

Coral Peacocks

Kirsch - Queer

When it comes to Kirsch, I feel like no other description is better than he's himself. I don't think he'd use any label for himself (I can, however, see him picking his favorite pride flag and saying that it's his).

Other characters

Kahono - Lesbian

Kahono definitely likes Noelle, I just interpret it as romantic. They were able to bond so much over their short time and the first thing that Kahono does after getting her voice back is hug Noelle, this is to saw she barely acknowledges Asta's existence. Then after going on the double date, Kahono just immediately suggests that she and Noelle go on date (Source: chapter 103).

We don't get to see what happens next but Kahono did start these dates to get Noelle to realize her feelings and seeing as how Noelle just sent Asta flying, my headcanon is that Kahono saw this as a way to shoot her shot to get Noelle to notice her.

You also have the fact that Kahono grew up in the Seabed Temple, meaning that her experiences with being queer are probably going to be different than the other characters and she's probably more open to it.

Sister Lily - AroAce

I headcanon Lily as a romance and sex repulsed aroace for two reasons. The first reason is how she views Asta's crush on her. Sure, Asta is annoying about his crush on her I also think that part of her disinterest comes from being aroace.

The other reason comes from the fact that she became a nun pretty early in her life. If I remember correctly, Lily became a nun when she was 16, that's a pretty young age to swear yourself to celibacy and I know people do it but there's a part of me that can't help but think it's because she's aroace and saw an out to any potential relationships.

Vanica - Lesbian

Vanica has men constantly falling over themselves to be with her, yet she doesn't really care too much about them. When it comes to the women, however, she's pretty open when talking about their beauty. Also, once again, because I'm me (and because of my moots), I do ship her with Noelle.

I know I have more but that's all I got at the moment

+ As a bonus

The characters who I think would be over the top with their allyship: Asta, Leopold, Klaus, Lumiere.

#sorry this took so long to respond to #i tried to keep things brief but #you activated my neurodivergent card (i even left out a few for my own sanity and spoilers)#black clover #black clover anime #vanessa enoteca #finral roulacase #grey black clover #luck voltia #magna swing #mimosa vermillion #fuegoleon vermillion #mereoleona vermillion #kahono black clover #anon

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folkloristico · 2 years ago

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As an Adrien stan who used to defend his writing back during season 3, I take everything back. I feel so sorry about the way he’s been treated by the writers—always put aside, always unaware of what’s happening even when it specifically concerns him.

“It’s better that he doesn’t know that his father was a villain.”

No, it isn’t. Marinette doesn’t get to decide that, Adrien does. He deserves to know that his father was an abuser. Gabriel doesn’t deserve to be remembered as a hero. I wasn’t expecting, nor did I want it, that Gabriel was going to be exposed to everyone because that would’ve reflected badly on Adrien, so I would understand if Marinette wanted to protect him from that. What it’s not fair is keeping him in the dark.

“But Adrienette is finally canon, aren’t you happy?”

As a hardcore Lovesquare fan since season 1, I absolutely am not. I wanted their relationship to be about honesty and trust. Why would I, as an Adrien stan, want him next to a person who’s lying to him? Who will likely be lying to him for the rest of their lives? Mind you, I’m not blaming Marinette (I love her even more than I love Adrien); I’m blaming the writing. For having us believe that any sort of criticism of the show comes from a place of misunderstanding of the canon material, because God forbid someone has an opinion that doesn’t align with the writers’ idea.

Anyways, Marinette and Adrien deserved so much better. Everyone did.

#anyway happy ladynoir july y’all whatever you got planned will be better than canon #ml salt #anti thomas astruc #miraculous ladybug salt #don’t know what others tags to add #adrien agreste #adrien marinette GET BEHIND ME!!!#i love them both so much they did them so dirty

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chronicallylatetotheparty · 2 years ago

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I feel like the fandom is ignoring the fact that Adrien is under no obligation to forgive Marinette.

Regardless of her reasons for lying to him what the finale establishes is that Marinette as a character is not trustworthy to Adrien specifically.

In that Adrien trusted her and she failed. Not failed to defeat Monarch but, much more importantly, failed his trust in her.

To the point where the best thing Adrien's narrative can do for his character is break up with her.

The writers established so many parallels between Marinette and Gabriel that at this point Adrien extending forgiveness wouldn't be a sign of his own development as a person but a return to his fawning trauma response.

Said parallels ignorantly reinforced by the writers constantly forcing Adrien to put aside his own needs and emotions in favor of supporting his "partner". (Syren, Kuro Neko, Risk)

Support the writers never allow Marinette to return.

So yeah, I think they should break up.

I'm so serious.

Ephemeral's whole premise is Marinette taking advantage of Adrien's trust in order to learn his identity so she can tell it to Su Han.

Catwalker is literally just Adrien fawning in a vain attempt to be trustworthy. The inciting incident being Ladybug not trusting Chat Noir when he asks to take on more responsibilities. Kuro Neko ending with nothing resolved and the idea that Adrien as a hero is superfluous reinforced in his head.

It's not just Marinette's pattern of behavior that contributes to this.

Adrien's relationships with those around him are frayed specifically because of the Guardians' rules. He values Ladybug's trust in him so much that Adrien is willing to hurt himself to follow what is expected of him as the holder of the Black Cat Miraculous.

But no one else is.

I mean that from a writing perspective not a character one.

Nino and Alya are revealed to each other due to necessity. Marinette breaks down and reveals herself to Alya.

And Adrien is still alone. Still expected to follow the rules that keep him isolated from his meager support network. Still expected to just be okay.

He has a girlfriend now! That means everything is fixed! No need to worry about his best friend calling him annoying to his face!

It's long been a fandom theory that Marinette doesn't see Chat Noir as "real".

And this is reinforced several times when she learns that Chat Noir found out something she kept from him, apologized, and then... changed nothing about how they function as a "team".

After meeting Scarabella and learning that someone knows Ladybug's identity Adrien is mad sure. But he goes right back to fawning. To saying that "it's okay" because he has so little self worth. Because the writers reinforced the fact that he is unnecessary.

And that's because the writers don't see Adrien as his own character. Don't see him as a "human" character least of all after literally dehumanizing him.

#ml recreation #adrien agreste #ml season 5 #ml analysis #ml writers salt #ml writing critical

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chloe-carrie · 4 days ago

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Fic: “Maybe, it's fate”

Chapter 1: “But he wanted another”

In the evening, after school, Marinette was sitting by the window, looking at the city lights. She was feeling so alone, so unwanted. Suddenly she heard the familiar feline mew.

“Cat Noir?” She whispered, looking at him in surprise.

“Hey, Marinette,” Cat Noir replied, easily climbing onto the balcony.

“What are you doing here?” Marinette asked, trying to hide her excitement.

“I came to check on you,” he said and saw her with care. “How are you?”

“I don't know, to be honest,” she whispered and shrugged her shoulders. — Such a confusing day.

“Tell me?”

Marinette looked at him as if he was her own. She has loved him for several years after she realized that loving Adrian no longer made sense. After all, in fact, because of her love for him, she always made catastrophic mistakes. The most important of all is the loss of the miraculouses. Quite recently, she confined the Dog miraculous to Felix, Adrian's brother, thinking that he was Adrian. He took away Lady Bug's yo-yo and gave it to the Shadow Moth. That was able to use this yo-yo to get all the other miraculouses, except for Lady Bug's earrings and Cat Noir's ring.

“Nothing special happened. It's just that every day I come across the boy I used to love.”

“Oh, I'm sorry.”

“Everything is okay, it's just unpleasant.”

“But why you loved? Now you don't?”

“No longer…” she drooped.

“But why?” Cat Noir was really surprised that because of some asshole, her relationship wasn't functioning. “What he did?”

“Nothing bad,” Marinette waved her hands, making clearly that everything was fine. “Just because of this love...” she looked into the distance and realized how hard it was to remember the past. “I've failed.”

At that moment, the Cat immediately realized how similar her situation was to Lady Bug — he still couldn't forget how he comforted his partner and said all good words if only to calm her down. After hearing this, he began to sympathize with Marinette even more. “Oh, I wish I could introduce her to Lady Bug...” he thought, briefly lost in his memories.

He loves Marinette for a long time, because it became clear that Lady Bug'd never look at him anyway, and he saw Marinette from the other side. She's wonderful, talented, kind, beautiful, generous!

“I'm sorry to bother you... I must have hurt you...” Cat even pushed his eyes aside.

“What? No!” Marinette was so shocked by Cat's words that she started screaming at him not to think badly about himself. “It's not your fault!”

“I don't know, I see how you are feeling…”

Cat Noir sighed, and Marinette started shaming herself in her mind.

“But not so that you blame yourself.” She clamped down, ‘hugging herself’ with her arms.

“You're right, sorry.” He decided to not avert his eyes and look directly at his luv.

“Okay,” Marinette smiled, then suggested an impulse idea: “Should we go get an ice cream?”

“Yeah,” Cat inspired, “and you will tell me everything.”

Marinette giggled.

“Would you mind?..” He didn't ask when he approached her.

“No, no,” she smiled: finally, she will in full force be close to her Cat.

Cat Noir picked her up, jumped off the balcony and climbed on the pole very high from the ground, looking for Andre.

“Do you see him?” Marinette peered into every crevice of the city from above, but due to her poor eyesight, she couldn't watch anything. “I don't.”

Cat was also peering, but unlike Marinette, he was a superhero and had great eyesight, even for a cat. “Yeah!” He pointed a finger at Amsterdam. “It looks like Andre will now walk near the sights to attract more attention,” he laughed.

Marinette found this joke very funny, and she laughed too — partly because of the good humor of her lover, and partly because of some kind of imitation.

They landed on the ground, right in front of Andre.

— Спасибо, — сказала Маринетт, когда тот поставил ее.

“Thank you,” Marinette said, when he put her down.

“No problem.” He even smiled.

They came to the ice cream man, and Marinette asked:

“Hey, Andre! How are you feeling?”

“My greetings, Marinette and Chat Noir! Very good! What about you?” Of course, he was very surprised by the unexpected appearance of the very beautiful couple, though unofficial…

“We're feeling adorable!” Cat laughed again, and Marinette laughed along with him.

“That's great! And in honor of this, I'm giving you the most special ice cream…” Andre put blueberry and orange balls on the cone, as if anticipating the common essence of the two lovers. “Blueberry for the beautiful and charming lady, and orange for the good-natured and frivolous mister!” After these words, he handed them the love shared between them.

“Thank you,” Cat Noir said and took the ice cream. “Have a nice day!”

“And you…” he wished them well, and when they went, he finished, “young lovers.”

After leaving, they began to walk along the bridge. Cat decided to not beat around the bush and asked directly:

“Tell me, what happened to you with that guy?”

Marinette, to be honest, didn't wanna discuss this theme, but she understood that sooner or later she would have to return, and she didn't wish to discuss it with herself, so she decided to dot the i's and cross the t's with her luv.

“Nothing special… I just used to love him, but… there was no way I could tell him what I felt” She was uncomfortable again and clamped down a little. “But recently I found out that he loves someone else, and I stopped feeling something like love for him…” and immediately looked away.

“Is it the only one reason you don't wanna be with him?”

At that moment he looked into her eyes and realized how hard it was to experience nonreciprocity.

“No… because of this love, I make mistakes that hurt all my dears…”

Marinette was sad. She understood she was unlikely to receive support from Cat Noir, because he, in fact, didn't know her at all, although she'd so much like his love for her. She's had feelings for him for a long time, but she's been hiding it for his sake.

“Don't worry,” he hugged her. “You can handle it, and if something happens, I'm here for you.”

Only then Marinette looked at him, realizing that she was able to completely trust her Cat, no matter what happened. They both smiled at each other and hugged stronger.

“Thank you.” In her eyes, there was the caring gratitude. “You're always very good friend.”

“You're welcome,” Cat Noir tried to say it without any emotion, although inside he understood he couldn't be more than a friend to Marinette, but he'd so like to… “Well, let's go,” he decided to dilute the atmosphere before everything got really bad, “tell me his name?”

“What for?” She felt awkward, but she got the thing if she didn't tell him, then trust could be destroyed, and after all, how can she be friends with him later when he feels distrust? “Is it… so important?” Choosing her words carefully, she tried to not offend him.

“Just interesting.” He shrugged his shoulders.” No, if you don't want, you don't have to tell.

“It's okay, I can.” She sighed. “It… It is…”

Cat looked at her and wasn't surprised at all by her indecision. But when he's Adrian, he sees how she sometimes messes up. He even smiled at those memories in his mind.

“It is Adrian Agreste,” she said finally and looked at Cat for some hope.

After hearing that, Cat's world collapsed. Inside, he loved Marinette and wanted to tell her about his love every second, but he knew that something bad could happen. So he even decided to tell her as Adrian, but when he heard that name, he hesitated. “Doesn't he love me anymore?.. And w-what sh-hould-d I d-do?” he thought and sighed heavily.

“Adrian Agreste?” He repeated cautiously. “Well, maybe she mistook?” He was still hoping, hoping that Marinette misspoke. And it'd be very weird, but Cat Noir, who had Adrian inside, didn't wanna realize the bitter truth.

“Yes…” «'Cause you're loved by me, my dear Cat, but Adrian, who hadn't loved me and thought I'm just a friend to him, isn't for a long time.»

The words of his beloved girl hurt him very much, and he felt his mind becoming clouded. Even if the pain inside was growing and it was hard for him, he only showed it for a second.

“Oh, it's… your classmate?” He asked, though he knew everything perfectly well.

“Yeah…” at this time she giggled: it was unusual for her to discuss past ‘relationships’ with current ones.

“Well, this is…” Cat Noir tried to pull himself together, and he was very good at it, but the realization wouldn't let him rest, “very interesting.”

“Maybe it is,” Marinette shrugged her shoulders. “Anyway, I will never see him as a girlfriend, so what's the point?”

“Probably you're right, but are you sure he loves someone else?” He wanted to exhaust Marinette's thoughts so that she'd think only good things about him.

“Yes, 'cause he said it by himself.”

“But you might be wrong.”

“That's right, but anyway, I'm transferring to another school and I'm unlikely to be able to see him.”

“What?” Cat rather shouted it. “Are you transferring to another school?!”

“Yeah…”

“Why?! Only because of that asshole?!”

“Not only because of him,” she mused, “Because I'm moving in soon and…”

“Are you moving?!” Not knowing why, he interrupted her. “Sorry for interrupting.” Cat lowered his eyes.

“It's okay,” she calmed him. “And yes, I'm moving.”

“Where to? And why?” He showed by his whole appearance that he didn't want she to do this, but he couldn't do anything.

“To the closest area. It's 'cause my parents opened a new bakery there, and this one was sold very profitably.” Marinette sighed heavily. “So now we're unlikely to see each other.”

“No way!” He shouted again. “We will see each other! I'll come to you every day…” he promised, and immediately thought, «Hmm, you won't be able to come every day, because of the school,» and corrected his words, “or rather, not just every day, but almost…”

Marinette giggled.

“I got you,” and smiled.

“That's good.” Everything inside him has become very colorful and meaningful to live in. To live in for her. “And don't worry about this egoist, he's not worth you.” For the sake of realism, he even hugged Marinette, and he shrank in his soul: «Fuck, don't you understand?! You're turning her against yourself!» “And if you need any support, then contact me, I'll come to you right away!”

“Thank you,” she smiled again. “You're much better,” «That's why I love you so much...» she added to herself.

“Well, I really like helping and being with that… I mean, I really like helping people!” He blushed because of the fact he almost told about his love to Marinette, although he was a little happy about it.

And she laughed again.

“I don't know who you're helping there, but your advices and jokes are very soothed.”

“Idiot, you just told her that you flirt with other girls!” Inside, Cat Noir reproached himself for the aforementioned and even wanted to hide somewhere, but stayed because of two reasons: first, Marinette would consider him crazy and definitely wouldn't accept him as a boyfriend; and second, he'd not be able to hide from himself, ‘cause Adrian would always follow him wherever he wasn't there.

“No, no, Marinette, I didn't mean it at all!” He started to prove he said some bullshit that wasn't related to the truth. “I got it all wrong again! I was thinking about something else that…” it was after that he realized he had stymied, and either he'd confess the truth or lie completely. “Eh, it seems I'm a jerk.”

“Why?”

“You will think I'm crazy, ‘cause I told you such nonsense!”

“Not at all,” Marinette turned her hands in different sides. “I agree I didn't understand you, but you don't have to explain every word you say. And if you meant that you talk to other girls, that's fine.”

“What?! But I don't talk to other girls!”

“Okay,” she nodded. “Then, what were you telling about?”

Cat Noir was very tight, he didn't wanna talk about his feelings at that moment, ‘cause it was too early. Yes, he might miss the chance, but he wasn't going to talk. Or he was?..

#cat noir #miraculous #heroes #ladybug #miraculous ladybug #marinette dupain cheng #marichat #my fic #fan fiction #fiction

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sweetcloverheart · 2 years ago

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Clover Rants Miraculously: No Victory For The Simple Soul

(Full disclosure - this is a vent post more than analysis so don’t expect anything deep)

I feel the S5 finale highlights the biggest and most glaring issue that this and the last three seasons have had - Marinette (and by extension Adrien and the rest) not being allowed meaningful victories.

The entire point of a finale battle (specifically one that has your main villain giving his Swan Song) is that the character gains something at the end of it. Even if the battle ends with the loss of a friend or the MC no longer having access to their extra helpful powerup/superform, it’s not supposed to be a complete defeat - they’re supposed to learn something and resolve themselves to do better, or gain a new insight into the villain and go investigate their new lead, or promise to never allow another loss like what they faced again.

Miraculous doesn’t have that in their finale battles. All of them always end with Mari and co taking the bigger loss compared to Gabemoth, and it’s never in a way that’s used to either foster character growth or drive towards a meaningful story development. In fact, the loss only seems to happen because the writers need them to lose so Gabe looks like a bigger threat than he is, and then do nothing with it. They do it all the time -

Miracle Queen - Fu’s removal causes Mari considerable stress over having to do Guardian work solo now and needed to reach out to the temps more often as she unconsciously pushes Chat away. Aside from Alya and the Anti-Akuma charms (which are then rendered worthless by the introduction of Mega-Akuma), Mari gets nothing out of his departure except having to accept she can’t date while being a superhero (unless it’s Adrien, and even that still has issues the show won’t address) and constantly having to babysit the Kwami. She doesn’t even get help in the form of backup mentor!Su Han.There’s nothing positive gained out of having to deal with no longer having a mentor to guide her, and eventually, the loss of him is forgotten all together.

Risk/Strikeback - Marinette losing all the Kwami after getting tricked by Felix gets her a mental breakdown, a broken heart after trying to pursue Chat, and even more stress as she basically has the lives and freedom of three characters shoved into her hands with no one able to help her. She doesn’t gain a new power or new ally like last time either, which just serves to further put her against the wall. Hell, her eventual “life saving powerup” doesn’t even come from being directly cornered by the main villain, but from being faced by the spoiled brat bully he’s manipulating and deciding “Actually we aren’t detransforming anymore”. Meanwhile, the peak of her “character arc” for her civilian life is highly reliant on a newly introduced character that wasn’t even built up to and a recton episode that just serves to put every questionable act the writers had her engage in in a bad light just so they can foist responsibility of whatever flaws the fans complained about onto another character (as opposed to just going “yeah, but I got better” and moving on). She lost so much, but got very little out of it in the end.

Even when taking down her minor antags, Marinette gets nothing out of the deal - “Revolution” had her finally get the chance shut down Chloe for good and show she had no power over her, but by that point Chloe had become kind of pathetic in terms of villainy (not to mention her being the pawn of a bigger scheme that allowed the real masterminds to flee judgement) and Mari’s been dunking on her since episode 1 anyways, so it really wasn’t all that satisfying from a cathartic standpoint, nor does she gain anything character wise. Meanwhile, Lila getting exposed did nothing to really impede or harm her, and now she’s out in the wild with her 800+ fake families and the Butterfly miraculous, so what was really even the point of Marinette’s bathroom plan?

And then there’s “Recreation” and Gabriel - who gets to have his wish, his comatose wife alive, his son no longer (rightfully) hating his guts, the city adoring him, a goddamn statue, being credited for the city turning into a “utopia”, and all sorts of praises and perks he didn’t even earn/deserve, all at the small cost of his death and the plot forcing Marinette to keep her mouth shut for him. Gabriel gets to have everything he’s been throwing a tantrum over for 5 full seasons, while Marinette once again gets nothing (actually no, she did gain something - tons and tons of fandom salt aimed at her for the writers choices) as she’s forced to take on the burden of hiding his crimes.

and it just makes me feel we wasted our time with the story because seriously, what was the point? Why have Marinette lose when this should have been the point where all her losses so far helped her achieve victory when it matters most? Why let Gabriel win and reward him for all his abuses and crimes when the entire story seemed to be building up to getting him to either accept Emilie’s death or be forced to face the consequences of his choices? Why be building up that conflict between Adrien and his father about his wants and needs vs Gabriel’s constantly escalating expectations and not have them confront eachother in the end? Why focus so much on the idea of Mari finally getting the butterfly away from Gabriel if you’re just going to just give it to a new (old) villain and render the entire 5 season long battle for it pointless?

What was even the point in Marinette suffering all those defeats if you weren’t even going to let her win at the end, or at least stop Gabriel from getting what he wanted?

I’ll admit the leaks didn’t raise my expectations for this season but DAMNIT, after seeing them actually change stuff like Andre terrible dialogue in “Collusion” (though what he ends up saying is worse somehow), I expected something to prove it was going to be worth it in the end - and yet just like Mari, I’m venomed in the back by the show for daring having some expectation for them to actually care about making their Heroine’s suffering actually matter!

#Clover Rants Miraculously #ML Salt

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mintaka14 · 5 months ago

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Welcome to Chapter 2 of Chrysanthemum White and Blood Red, my ML Lukanette Hanahaki fic. There is angst ahead, lots of angst. Also, check the warnings and tags.

Chrysanthemum White and Blood Red

A Miraculous Ladybug fanfiction

By Mintaka14

Chapter 2

What I wanted was to fall asleep

Close my eyes and drift away

[Flowers (Hadestown): Anais Mitchell]

The flowers in her lungs were not the first secret Marinette had kept to herself. They weren’t even the biggest one.

Marinette had more than her share of secrets. They came with the territory as Ladybug, and one of them was hovering anxiously at her shoulder, watching her with huge, worried eyes as the akuma alert came in.

Marinette hated the lies and evasions that went with being Ladybug, but for all the damage Ladybug’s secrets did to her, they left simple, clean wounds. She knew exactly what she was keeping from the friends and family who cared about her, and what sparked the annoyance and disappointment in their eyes.

Ladybug’s secrets weren’t the ones that seeded stealthily within her and tangled their roots through her lungs and heart, ripping pieces out of her with every breath because she couldn’t even tell what the truth was anymore, let alone speak it.

“Marinette –“ Tikki said apprehensively “- are you sure you’re alright to transform?”

In truth, it was taking everything she had to come to her feet and reach for the miraculous. But really, what other choice was there? She was the only one who could cleanse the akumatised butterfly and fix whatever damage the akuma did, and Paris needed her. And as weary as she was, it was almost a relief to put aside worrying about the rattle of her lungs to focus on the uncomplicated problem of saving the city.

She could see the trail of destruction the akuma had left through the city as she swung out over Paris, and she followed the path until she found Chat perched on a rooftop, surveying the damage.

He perked up as she landed heavily beside him.

“M’lady! What took you so long? I missed your purrfect purresence.”

She couldn’t summon the energy to even scoff at the terrible puns.

“What are we dealing with?”

He kept shooting her odd looks as he filled her in on the akuma, and when she stood to go after it, he blocked her path.

“Is everything alright?”

She opened her mouth to say I’m fine, and felt the familiar acid taste of bile. She lifted a hand to wave him away instead.

“We’ve got an akuma to deal with,” she said, and stepped up onto the edge of the roof as he reluctantly moved aside.

For once there were no jokes as they fought the akuma, and she could feel Chat glancing her way. She couldn’t be anything but grateful when he finally pinned the akuma under his staff and cataclysmed the object, releasing the black and purple butterfly to flutter upwards into the sky.

Ladybug mustered the energy to cast up her yoyo and cleanse the butterfly, but almost fumbled the catch as her yoyo fell back into her hand. As the storm of healing ladybugs swirled around them, she reached out to bump fists with Chat, and found him eyeing her in concern.

He caught at her wrist before she could escape.

“M’lady, what’s going on?”

Her earrings chimed a soft warning, and she tried to tug her arm free, but she was too exhausted to break his hold. She could have cried with the need to get home and collapse.

“Chat, I have to go.”

“Meet me tonight, then,” he insisted, his face still creased with concern under his mask. Her earrings chimed again. With her transformation getting close to wearing off, with her legs just about ready to give out under her and her skin feeling clammy, it was easier to nod than to work her way around an explanation she couldn’t give.

“Tonight,” she promised reluctantly, and staggered as he finally released her. She stepped back out of reach. Before he could say anything else, she launched her yoyo and swung away out of sight.

She managed to reach an empty side street before her transformation gave out, and she dropped clumsily into the shadows, slumping back against the graffitied wall as Tikki hovered in front of her.

“Marinette?” the tiny god asked anxiously, and Marinette held up a hand to deflect the inevitable questions. The movement felt far too heavy, and Tikki didn’t look at all convinced, but at least she stayed silent as Marinette crept back into the house and past the family doorway into the bakery without drawing her mother’s watchful eye.

Tikki wasn’t any less anxious when Marinette reached out later that night to transform back into Ladybug, but she’d told Chat that she would be there.

She thought guiltily of the bigger things she’d had to refuse her partner – her true identity, the identity of the temporary miraculous holders, and her heart when he’d asked her to love him. The least she could do was turn up when she’d promised him she’d be there.

He was already there, and pacing, when she landed.

“M’lady, what’s going on? Or is this another secret you can’t tell me?” he asked, and it sounded like an accusation. “Are you sick?”

“I’m fine,” she tried to say, but the truth she’d refused to admit caught in her lungs and left her coughing. Ladybug pressed a hand to her mouth, but petals fell between her fingers, drifting down to the rooftop, and she heard Chat’s breath catch in horror.

“Hanahaki,” he whispered.

Of course he knew what it was when he saw the symptoms. He would have read up on all the rare accounts of hanahaki avidly. He would have read the fairy tales, and seen the anime and movies that painted it in melancholy and moving colours of romantic tragedy. Her partner believed with every beat of his heart in true love and courtly devotion.

To die for love, wasting away while flowers fell from silent lips… oh yes, Chat knew the significance of the blood-soaked blossoms she’d just coughed up.

“So now you know,” she said, her voice made scratchy by the lingering irritation of the petals. “But it won’t stop me from being here when Ladybug’s needed, I promise.”

“That’s not what I’m worried about!”

She had to be imagining the light of hope in his green eyes. She must be more out of it than she’d thought.

“It’s been a rough day. I’d better get home.” She turned to go, and he grabbed her wrist, as he had after the akuma, keeping her in place.

“You can’t just leave like that,” he protested.

“Chat…”

“I won’t even say I told you so,” he promised, hitting her with a roguish and charming grin that she was too exhausted to be charmed by. Her brain felt too sluggish to work out what he meant. When she didn’t respond, his grin faded into something closer to desperation. He still had a hold on her wrist.

“I’ve tried to be patient. I’ve respected that you wanted to wait, but don’t you think it’s time you admitted it? M’lady, this denial is killing you.”

Marinette could have laughed at the thought of Chat and patience, if she’d had any breath left for it. Instead, she shook her head, pressing her free hand to her aching throat.

“Admit what?” she rasped. What could she possibly have to say to Chat that would take away the flowers filling her lungs?

“You know!” He shifted his grasp to clutch at her hands, holding them fast against his chest. “You know how much I love you, M’lady. Why can’t you just tell me how you feel?”

“I have told you.” Her voice was harsh and raw. Marinette tried to tug her hands free, but there was no strength left in her. “Chat, you know exactly how I feel about you.”

“Then why do you have hanahaki?” he said stubbornly.

“Don’t make me do this, Chat.”

She was too tired. Too tired, and he was hurting her. Her wrists felt bruised under his hands.

“Just try it,” he pleaded.

He was so persistent. And she was too tired to argue anymore, too tired to be gentle in turning him down when he was so determined to only see her gentleness as not yet instead of never, so she forced out the words he’d always longed to hear and let the hanahaki show him the brutal truth.

“Chat Noir, you’re the one I love,” she sighed resignedly, already feeling the warning prickle in her chest. “There’s no… no one else…” Her lungs seized up, fighting to breathe through the words in her mouth as she hacked and coughed, and then her stomach twisted and heaved in reaction, vomiting up the lies he’d been desperate to hear until they splashed in gouts of white blossoms flecked with red around her feet.

She sagged against Chat, her hands still caught against his chest as she heaved again, shaking, with the taste of flowers and bile on her tongue. More crushed blossoms tore at her throat and spilled from her mouth onto the rooftop between them until there was nothing left to vomit up and her stomach clenched painfully.

There was a long, silent moment while Marinette stared down at the mess of flowers, still shaking. When she finally mustered the energy to raise her head, she found herself looking into Chat’s face blanched behind the mask, wide-eyed and devastated.

She could see the realisation in his eyes, as the hanahaki drove home the truth of what she had been trying to tell him for so long. Chat believed, finally, painfully, that she truly didn’t love him in the way he wanted. It tore at Marinette in ways that hurt almost more than the flowers in her lungs that he would believe a handful of chrysanthemum buds when he had refused to accept anything she’d said.

As if he couldn’t bear to meet her gaze, his eyes fell slowly to the petals and bone white blossoms marred with faint red spots scattered across his boots.

She could hear the rough inhale and release of his breath, and it sounded loud in the still night air above Paris. His hands tightened on hers for a moment, pressing them to his heart, and then he let them go and stepped back.

“Whoever he is,” Chat said gently, “you should tell him.”

He tried to smile at her.

“Go home and rest, Ladybug.”

~~~~~

Marinette had no idea how she managed to make it home. By grace, or whatever scraps of luck Tikki granted her, she somehow made it to the alleyway behind the bakery and let her transformation go. She slumped against the brick wall while Tikki hid in her handbag again.

Marinette could hear her father humming tunelessly in the back room, getting everything ready for the next morning, and she was grateful that her mother was too busy closing up the bakery for the night to do more than call out a quick, distracted greeting over her shoulder as she heard Marinette come in through the family entrance. Her maman wouldn’t be put off by assurances that everything was okay.

It was all she could do to make it up the stairs. When she stumbled into her bedroom, and collapsed on the couch, Tikki zipped out of the bag to hover over her anxiously.

“Marinette, you have to tell your parents,” the tiny kwami piped. “You’re sick.”

“You know what will happen,” Marinette mumbled into the cushions, wishing that she could just sleep. “Tests, doctors, hospital. And they’ll be watching me all the time. I can’t be Ladybug if they’re watching me.”

“But, Marinette…”

“I’ll tell them once Hawkmoth’s defeated,” she promised, exhaustion pulling her down into couch.

Let go, and sink into the heavy darkness of sleep, she thought hazily. To sleep, perchance to dream…

“You’re not going to defeat Hawkmoth in this condition,” Tikki said, and the sharp concern in her voice reached through the fog.

“Hopefully,” Marinette murmured distantly, “your next Ladybug will do a better job of dealing with him.”

They couldn’t do worse… The miserable thought followed her down into uneasy dreams of falling flowers and Paris in ruins.

~~~~~

Alya was starting to get worried when Marinette finally turned up for school in the morning. She was used to Marinette arriving at the last minute, but there was no sign of Marinette’s customary panicked fluster in the girl with tired shadows under her eyes who dropped heavily into the seat beside Alya and slumped until her forehead was resting on the desk. Alya tried to talk to her before class started, but Marinette just muttered something about bad dreams and bad sleep.

And then she’d vanished just before lunch. Alya was left scrambling to make excuses to a confused Adrien, who had been lured into the art room instead of the lunch he was supposed to be having with Nino. Rose, who’d been tasked with getting Marinette to the art room, reported that she couldn’t find her, so Alya abandoned Rose and Adrien and the ruins of her latest plan to search the school for her best friend.

There was no sign of Marinette in the girls’ bathroom, or the library, or the locker room. And the seat beside Alya in class remained frustratingly, worryingly empty for the rest of the afternoon, until the bell rang to dismiss them all.

“Really, what’s the point if she’s not even going to be here?” Alya fumed under her breath as she stalked down the school steps towards Marinette’s bakery. She let the irritation distract her from the apprehension churning in her stomach, and pushed the bakery door open with a wild jangling of bells.

The customers queued up at the counter glanced around at the noise. Marinette’s mother looked up from the loaf of bread she was sliding into a bag.

“Alya, dear.” Sabine’s face was her usual smiling calm, but Alya could see the creases of worry in the corners of her eyes as her gaze moved past Alya as if she was looking for something. “Is school finished already? Did Marinette have to stay behind today?”

Alya froze for a heartbeat.

“She… I… we’re meeting here…” she stuttered, and was profoundly relieved when Sabine’s attention was claimed by the customer holding out payment for the bread before Alya could dig herself in too deep. Sabine waved Alya through the private door without any further questions, and Alya almost ran up the stairs towards Marinette’s bedroom.

She couldn’t hear any sounds coming from the other side of the door. There was always sound and movement and chaos in Marinette’s room, and Alya wondered, with a rising sense of panic, if Marinette had even come home from school. Sabine obviously hadn’t seen her come in. Where would she have gone if not here?

The knock Alya gave on Marinette’s bedroom door was sharp and perfunctory, and she shoved the door open before the sound had even faded away.

The sewing machine was silent, and Marinette’s latest project was a puddle of silky fabric on the floor. It looked as though it had just spilled from her hand and lain untouched where it had fallen. It was disturbing just how long it took Alya to realise that the room wasn’t actually empty, without that boundless, restless energy and whirl of Marinette’s creativity that usually filled it.

Marinette was curled up on her couch, staring blankly at nothing.

Alya knew that she’d made enough noise to be heard as she climbed the steps into Marinette’s room, but it wasn’t until Alya came to stand at the edge of the chaise that Marinette tilted her head with a pale shadow of a smile. She looked as if every movement hurt, and her face was alarmingly washed out against the couch’s bright pink cushions.

“Sabine didn’t see you come in?” Alya started, idly picking up a reel of cotton thread from the floor and putting it back on Marinette’s desk. “She thought you were staying late at school. I was starting to think maybe you’d gone to the Liberty or something instead of coming home.”

“Maman was busy when I came home at lunchtime, and I just didn’t have the energy to pretend I was okay, so I came in the back way,” Marinette said without lifting her head from the cushions.

“You haven’t told your parents?” Alya asked quietly, and Marinette shrugged listlessly.

“What can they even do? They’ll just want to know why I can’t say something and get the hanahaki out of my system.”

“I don’t even understand why you can’t just say something,” Alya said, trying so hard to speak calmly. Why couldn’t Marinette just say something? All she had to do was open her mouth and speak, and everything would be all better, and Alya wouldn’t have to be so scared. “I had Adrien all lined up this afternoon, and I had to call in a lot of favours to get him to show up in the art room. I even had Alix running interference just in case Kagami showed up, but you weren’t there.”

“I had to go home. I wasn’t feeling well.”

“Well, you’re not going to get better if you don’t say something to Adrien.”

“You think I haven’t tried?” Marinette snapped back with a sudden burst of more animation than Alya had seen from her in weeks. She tried to sit up, two spots of hectic colour burning in her cheeks. “It’s not going to work. It’s never going to work! I’ve tried -!”

“Not hard enough when you’re still coughing up those damn flowers!” Alya shouted back, fighting the urge to reach out and shake her best friend.

From somewhere in the apartment below them, Sabine’s voice called out, “Marinette? Is that you? Is everything alright?”

Marinette’s chest was heaving with the effort to breathe.

“I can’t do this,” she wheezed, and Alya watched helplessly as she fought to get her reaction under control. “I can’t – I can’t -”

Alya stretched out a tentative hand to her friend, and Marinette shook her head.

“Not now,” Marinette rasped. “Just go –“

Alya spun on her heel and marched to the door before she could say something she’d regret. She clenched her hands to stop them from shaking.

Alya passed Sabine on the stairs, but was too caught up in her own thoughts to notice the look of concern that followed her down.

If Marinette was going to keep ducking Adrien at school, then Alya would just have to bring Adrien to the one thing that she knew Marinette wouldn’t miss, even if she was on her deathbed.

Tough love, she reminded herself.

~~~~~

Alya surveyed the group of girls sitting around her bedroom. They gazed back at her with varying degrees of wariness.

“Where’s Marinette? Shouldn’t she be here for this?” Rose asked.

“Not this time. She keeps dodging me.”

It looked like Juleka was frowning behind the fall of her purple and black hair when Alya shot her a surreptitious look, but it was hard to be sure. It was always hard to be sure what was going on with Juleka.

“What do you mean, she’s dodging you?” Alix asked suspiciously. “Doesn’t she want to do this?”

“She will, once we help her. She’s just feeling nervous – you know how Marinette gets,” Alya reassured them impatiently.

Alix flopped backwards onto Alya’s bed with a put-upon sigh. “This is such a waste of time.”

“Wait, am I Tulip again this time?” Rose asked.

“No! No flowers!” Alya snapped out harshly. They all stared at her, and she tried again, a little calmer this time. “No code names, and definitely no flowers. We’re going to keep this simple – we’re going to invite Adrien to the Kitty Section rehearsal this weekend,” she announced.

There was a long silence. Mylène exchanged an uneasy glance with Rose.

“Are… you sure that’s a good idea?” Mylène said slowly. “I mean, remember what happened last time, and Ivan’s been really stressing about the music festival coming up…”

“And Alya’s turning it into another Adrien scheme,” Alix groaned. “Must be a day ending in ‘y’. Were you even going to ask the band if they’re okay with that?”

“I’m asking,” Alya protested, and ignored Alix’s muttered Didn’t sound like a question to me.

“It’s only supposed to be a band rehearsal with a small audience to get ready for the gig,” Mylène persisted.

“We’re all going to be there,” Alya pointed out impatiently. “And Nino would have been there if he didn’t have his family thing on Saturday. What’s one more person?”

“But… it’s Adrien…”

Alya frowned at Mylène as she trailed off.

Alix raised her hands. “Don’t look at me. It’s not my show, not my decision. I’m not getting involved.”

Alya turned to Rose, who could always be counted on to back her up in any romantic plans, but Rose was looking at Juleka, her expression worried.

“Jules?” Rose said softly. “What do you think? It’s going to be at your place, so it’s your call.”

Behind the curtain of her hair, Juleka looked like a deer caught in the headlights.

“Juleka?” Alya prodded, and Juleka’s eyes met Alya’s, the panic changing into an unmistakable anger that Alya had never seen from the quiet girl before.

She could understand that Juleka was feeling conflicted, but this wasn’t just about Juleka’s brother being in love with Marinette anymore.

“Juleka?” Alya repeated more insistently, refusing to be intimidated. “I need you to invite Adrien to the rehearsal.”

Juleka mumbled something that Alya couldn’t make out, and pushed herself to her feet. She was gone before anyone could stop her.

“Jules!” Rose called after her in distress, and shot a distracted glance at Alya. “Sorry, Alya, I have to…”

And Rose left to follow Juleka.

In the awkward silence after the door closed behind Rose, Mylène gathered up her bag and her coat, and edged out of the room with a murmured farewell. Alya turned back to find Alix still there with her arms crossed and an unimpressed expression on her face.

“What?” Alya asked, a touch belligerently, but Alix just shook her head and sauntered out.

Alya was left alone in her room, frowning into space. She had to admit that Adrien would probably brush it off if she tried to talk him into coming to the rehearsal – she’d kind of cried wolf a few too many times lately with ‘emergencies’ or things Adrien just had to turn up for, only for Marinette to bail on her. It wasn’t like it was easy for Adrien to find the time in his schedule in the first place, and Nino was starting to balk whenever she tried to get him involved. So as far as she could see, there was only one other course of action left.

With a decisive nod, Alya girded her loins and headed for the Liberty. If she was lucky, Juleka hadn’t gone straight home.

It wouldn’t have stopped her if Juleka had been there – Alya was not one to put off an unpleasant task, especially when her best friend’s life was on the line – but she was rather relieved that there was no sign of Juleka when she reached the docks along the river.

She followed the soft, electric sound of guitar music up the gangplank and towards the back of the Liberty, and found Luka perched on top of a pile of boxes that cluttered the deck. The blue tips of his hair hid his face as he bent over his electric guitar, until some sound alerted him to her presence, and he looked up. His fingers paused on the strings.

“Hey, Alya,” he greeted her easily. “Jules is down below, if you’re looking for her.”

“Actually, I wanted to talk to you.” She trailed off, trying to find the tactful way to say what she’d come there for. Luka waited, watching her, with no hint of what he was really thinking on his face. She opened her mouth, and closed it again.

Finally, she blurted out baldly, “I want you to invite Adrien to the rehearsal on Saturday.”

His eyebrow lifted a little. Alya watched him closely for some other reaction, but his expression remained serene and mildly interested. Surely there would be some hint of jealousy at Adrien’s name, if Luka was really as into Marinette as all that. No one had a poker face that good if they were seriously in love. She knew Nino would have been frothing at the mouth by now, if he’d been in Luka’s shoes.

Alya started to feel a little better about asking him. Luka was a musician; he probably said things like that line about sincere melodies to all the girls.

“Is there a reason you particularly want Adrien there?” Luka asked. “There’s no guarantee he’ll be able to come even if we ask him.”

“I’m pretty sure he’ll come if you invite him.” If he didn’t, there was always chloroform and kidnapping, as a last resort. Alya was getting desperate.

She braced herself for the inevitable objections. She’d prepared the counter-arguments in her head on the way there - after all, why would Luka invite his love rival? But Luka regarded her silently for a long, uncomfortable moment.

“I’ll see what I can do,” he said eventually, and when Luka stood, his guitar held loosely in his hand, Alya took it as the end of the conversation. It felt slightly anticlimactic, but she murmured her thanks, and strode back the way she came in what was definitely not a retreat. In her haste, Alya nearly ran into Juleka coming out of the companionway onto the deck.

Juleka raised her head. Half her face was shadowed by the fall of her purple and black hair, her expression unchanging, but there was a hard look in the eye that Alya could see. Alya had to fight the urge to back away.

Alya understood, she really did - Juleka was Luka’s sister, and Luka liked Marinette. But this was to save Marinette’s life. Even Juleka couldn’t argue with that, if she knew the whole story.

~~~~~

Juleka watched as Alya crossed the gangplank. Alya didn’t turn back to look in her direction, but her shoulders were set as if she half-expected a knife in the back. The idea was awfully tempting.

Once Alya had reached the dock and hurried away into the city streets, Juleka stared after her for a long minute, and then she pivoted to go in search of her brother.

She found him near the aft of the deck. His guitar hung silent in one hand, and he was fiddling aimlessly with his phone. But the look on his face…

“I’m going to kill Alya,” Juleka growled.

Luka said wearily, “She’s only trying to help Marinette.”

“But she doesn’t have to hurt you to do it. And you’re just going to let Alya do it. I can’t believe you’re going along with whatever scheme Alya’s come up with.”

“If it’s what Marinette wants –“

“Yeah, I know you’re an idiot when it comes to anything to do with her, but that doesn’t mean you have to watch it happen. On our boat, in your home.”

Luka shrugged, and tucked his phone into his pocket. “It doesn’t matter. It’s done.”

“What?”

“I’ve asked Adrien to come on Saturday. Whether he shows up or not, whatever happens, it’s out of my hands now.”

Juleka huffed out a furious breath, and turned away. “Why can’t Marinette put us all out of our misery and just ask him herself?” she muttered under her breath, but Luka heard her.

“Jules,” he said warningly, and she glanced back. “You of all people should know how hard it can be to tell someone how you feel.”

It was as close as he ever came to rebuking her. She could feel her face scrunch up, and he met her eyes, holding them until he saw the silent contrition in her. When Luka let her go and turned his attention back to his guitar, Juleka let out another ragged breath and headed down to her bedroom.

She was pretending to be asleep when she eventually heard him come downstairs and move around on his side of the curtain that divided their bedroom. She listened to the soft thump as he dropped onto his bed, and she waited for him to plug the headphones into his guitar, as he always did.

The Liberty was a noisy place to grow up. Living on the Seine there was always noise, and people along the banks of the river, boats knocking against the docks and the constant lap of waves against the hull. Machinery vibrated and clanked in the engine room, rumbling through the bulkheads and the floor underfoot. Sounds echoed and travelled in the confines below deck, and filtered through the makeshift walls and curtains that divided up the close space. Juleka was used to being surrounded by noise.

Her mother’s voice carried over everything whenever she was on board. Anarka Couffaine was a woman who didn’t seem to know the meaning of the word quiet, not as it applied to her. Sometimes, Juleka wondered if she’d become so quiet herself as a way to rebel against her mother’s loud anarchy. But the most constant sound that Juleka associated with the Liberty and home was music.

There was always music on the Liberty, some instrument playing or someone singing or humming along. There was always Kitty Section filling the deck with sound, or Anarka belting out a protest song at full volume with a bottle in her hand, or Luka playing whatever tune was wandering through his head and fingers. Juleka couldn’t remember a night when she hadn’t fallen asleep to the muted sound of guitar strings from her brother on the other side of the curtain, his headphones on as he worked through something on his favourite guitar.

Tonight, though, Juleka listened in vain for the sound of strings.

She knew Luka was awake. He was too silent to be asleep, her brother who played music like he breathed air. Her sweet, stupid brother who would have ripped his heart out and offered it up on a plate if he’d thought it would do Marinette any good.

The sound of the river slapping against the hull of the Liberty, and the soft, rumbling chug of boats passing them, felt too loud without the music that usually played a counterpoint to the uneven rhythm of the ship’s constant noises.

Her phone chimed with an incongruously cheerful little melody, startling her in the darkness. Rose’s tune. She knew Rose was just worried about her after everything that had happened at Alya’s place, but she couldn’t deal with Rose’s relentlessly romantic sensibilities just then, not in that moment when romance and love sucked so bad.

She shut her phone off without looking at it, and everything fell silent again. Juleka turned her face into her pillow so that her brother wouldn’t hear her crying, and she wished that he’d never met Marinette.

~~~~~

Marinette was absent from school for the rest of the week, and wasn’t answering any of the texts or messages Alya sent her. Alya tried to reassure herself that she would have heard if the worst had happened. Marinette was… not fine, but she would come to the Kitty Section rehearsal, and Alya would fix everything.

Alya took less than her usual satisfaction in being proved right when Marinette turned up at the Liberty for the rehearsal, every movement lacking her usual frenetic energy. A casual observer might not have noticed, but Alya took one look at her best friend’s face, and shoved aside the morbid thought that her prediction about Marinette rising from her deathbed to be there had been a little too close to home.

Judging from the way Luka’s eyes kept cutting towards her as he played, Alya wasn’t the only one aware that Marinette was far too pale and quiet, and that she was surreptitiously leaning against the boat rail for support. There was a tiny crease between Luka’s brows that didn’t leave even when Marinette met his gaze and managed a ghost of a smile in response.

She was avoiding Alya, though, and hadn’t spoken a word to her since she’d arrived.

There was no sign of Adrien yet, but Alya kept turning to glance anxiously at the dock.

This had to work.

And then Adrien arrived. With Kagami.

Marinette stayed where she was. She didn’t take part in the backslaps and chorus of greetings as Adrien and Kagami stepped off the gangplank onto the boat, but she did straighten and let go of the rail as they drew closer. Alya could see what the effort cost her in the drawn lines around her eyes, and for a second she was tempted to just shove Kagami over the side into the river.

“I didn’t think you’d all mind - I brought Kagami,” Adrien beamed at the group gathered around them.

“The more the merrier,” Marinette told him, with a soft smile for the girl at Adrien’s side.

The band launched into another song, but it couldn’t be said that Alya was paying much attention. At some point, Mylène appeared at her elbow, and handed her a cup. Alya downed the contents without really noting what she was drinking.

“They’re sounding good, aren’t they?” Mylène said doubtfully, her eyes on the stage.

If Alya had been thinking about it, she might have said that they seemed a bit flat. Rose kept hitting her cues late, and Luka was acting like he was sleepwalking through the whole performance. It was a testament to his skill with a guitar that no one would have noticed that his mind wasn’t on the music if they couldn’t see the way that his attention kept drifting to where Marinette was standing with Kagami and Adrien.

But the band could have been playing The Muppets’ Greatest Hits for all Alya was aware, or cared.

Alya could see the way Marinette was fading by the second even as she talked softly with Kagami, while Adrien smiled at them both. Alya’s gaze gravitated to the hand Kagami had tucked through Adrien’s arm. She could feel herself glaring, and tried to smooth out the expression before anyone could notice.

Now, if only Alya could get Kagami away from them for just a moment…

Kagami was laughing at something Marinette was saying. Alya didn’t think she’d ever seen Kagami smile, let alone laugh.

Kagami shot Marinette an oddly light-hearted glance. “You haven’t taken your eyes off the stage, Marinette,” she said, and it sounded almost teasing in spite of her overly stiff phrasing. “Isn’t the guitarist the young man who came ice-skating with us – Luka Couffaine? How is your relationship with him progressing?”

“We’re not –” Marinette protested. “I don’t –“ Her denial broke off with a gasp as her face grew paler. “I –“

She doubled over as a wrenching, hacking cough shook her.

“Marinette?” Kagami was saying in alarm.

Luka stopped playing with a sharp screech of discordant notes. The band stumbled to a halt in confusion, but he was already ripping his precious guitar over his head, shoving it at Juleka as he jumped from the stage.

Blood-soaked petals tumbled from Marinette’s mouth, splattering violently across the deck as she coughed up more crushed flowers. And they just kept falling, and falling… Alya could see the stricken, terrified look on Marinette’s face, and her own heart clutched in response.

“Tell him!” Alya screamed at her. “Tell Adrien, or I will!”

Adrien’s face was a study in bewilderment and dawning horror, his green eyes fixed on Marinette, but at that they shifted from Marinette to Alya and back again. “Tell me what?”

“Adrien, I … have feelings for you,” Marinette managed to choke out, and her tone was hopeless. “I – I –“

She swayed again, and all the remaining colour bleached from her face. That was all the warning they had. When she crumpled, Adrien lunged to catch her.

Luka moved faster.

He caught her before she could hit the deck, and Alya screamed as Marinette convulsed in a paroxysm of coughing. Flowers and blood covered Luka’s shirt as he held Marinette, but he didn’t seem to notice. Marinette’s eyes closed, her lashes a dark smear against the pallor of her cheeks.

“Nononono,” he was repeating under his breath, Marinette bundled tight in his arms. “Marinette, sweetheart, wake up. Wake up.”

Kagami’s sharp cry broke through the startled silence from everyone watching, as she took a distracted step towards Marinette, and pulled up short as her eyes flicked back to Adrien.

Alya stared in horror at Marinette’s limp form. “It didn’t work,” she breathed. She turned wide eyes on Adrien. “Why didn’t it work?”

But Adrien’s attention was fixed on Marinette cradled in Luka’s arms, and he didn’t seem to hear when Kagami said his name, or notice her hand touch his arm uncertainly. There was a look of devastated realisation in his eyes that Alya didn’t have the capacity to analyse in the middle of her own frozen nightmare.

Then Marinette stirred, and everything jolted back into motion.

“Marinette,” Luka breathed.

Marinette’s eyes opened, dazed and unfocused. She stared up at Luka as if she was in a dream.

“Luka.” Marinette’s hand came up to brush his cheek, and she sighed, “I love you.”

Her eyes closed again. Alya realised that Luka was shaking with sobs, and that the ragged rise and fall of Marinette’s breath was evening out now.

No more flowers fell from her lips.

~~~~~

Alya stared blankly at her friend as Luka gathered Marinette up carefully, and stood.

How had she missed this?

Howhowhow?

Marinette’s face was so pale and still, her lashes a black fringe on colourless cheeks as Luka cradled her close, but she was still breathing, her chest rising and falling softly.

Stillbreathingstillbreathing –

And Luka… Alya had never seen anything like the look in his dark blue eyes as he carried Marinette away from them. She gave an involuntary shudder.

There was a hushed silence across the deck. And Adrien –

Adrien was leaving. Alya caught the disjointed bits of his whispered conversation with Kagami, and then, Kagami’s voice slightly louder, “But we can’t go now. What if Marinette -?”

“Luka’s looking after her. She doesn’t need… me.”

Alya caught herself as she took the first step to stop him. It wasn’t like it mattered now. This wasn’t some romantic plan gone awry anymore, and there were bigger things to worry about. She watched Adrien leave the Liberty, with a stricken look on his face and a murmured, disjointed excuse about his driver waiting for him.

“Is this what all the Adrien schemes this week were all about?” a sharp voice said, and Alya spun around to face Alix. “Why didn’t you tell us Marinette has hanahaki?”

Because Marinette had told her not to tell, and best friends kept secrets for each other, didn’t they? She’d been doing the right thing. Best friends knew best…

“Adrien schemes?” Kagami’s clear, cold voice chimed in, and Alya startled. She hadn’t even noticed that Kagami had remained behind when Adrien left.

Alya glanced around, and became aware that Juleka and Rose had disappeared at some point. They reappeared from below deck, and Rose shook her head when Mylène murmured something to her and tilted an anxious look in the direction Luka had carried Marinette. Juleka was holding a mop and bucket, and started cleaning the vomit and blood still spattered across the deck.

“Was this all a part of some scheme to bring Marinette and Adrien together?” Kagami asked.

“Did you miss the part where Marinette has hanahaki?” Alya said incredulously, turning back to face down Kagami. “You do know what that means, right?”

“I did not miss Marinette’s illness and collapse. Nor did I miss that you were the one shouting at Marinette to confess, in spite of the fact that Marinette has told me that she no longer has feelings for Adrien.”

“Well, of course she’d say that!” Wasn’t it obvious? “She didn’t want to upset you.”

“Except she clearly told me the truth about how she feels.” Kagami indicated the mess beside them on the deck that Juleka was mopping up. “Didn’t Marinette tell you the same thing?”

Kagami just didn’t understand Marinette like Alya did. Marinette always got so caught up in overthinking everything, she just needed a bit of a push sometimes.

“Yet you encouraged her to pursue Adrien,” Kagami went on. “How could you do that to Marinette, and to Adrien?”

“To Adrien? Marinette’s the one who was going to die! I was trying to save her life!”

“But confessing to Adrien didn’t save her at all, and put him through the pain in that moment of blaming himself for Marinette’s suffering, and believing he would have to reject a good friend who cared about him enough to develop hanahaki.”

Kagami’s air of righteous judgement was too much to take.

“Are you so sure he would have turned her down?” Alya pushed back, her arms folded in front of her. “I mean, you’ve been on a few dates, but you’re not officially his girlfriend yet, are you? And I saw his face when he realised what the hanahaki meant.”

There was a silence, fragile and sharp as glass, and a small, mean part of Alya felt a bit of satisfaction at the look on Kagami’s face.

Kagami took a trembling breath. “Yet you failed to see how Marinette looks at Luka, for all you pride yourself on your powers of observation.”

Alya opened her mouth to refute the attack, to point out all the times she’d teased Marinette about Luka distracting her from her crush on Adrien, and then she closed her mouth again.

Juleka had been mopping the flowers from the deck, but she lifted her head at that, and the look in her eyes was hard.

“Maybe if you hadn’t been so caught up in pushing all those stupid plans to get her together with Adrien, it wouldn’t have got to the point where Marinette’s throwing up flowers and my brother’s tearing his heart out,” Juleka muttered, and Alya was stung into reaction.

“Oh, don’t pretend you weren’t involved in all those plans, Rose,” Alya snapped the flower codename at Juleka as a reminder of one of their convoluted plots. Rose glanced up in confusion at the sound of her name. “And you still would be, if your brother wasn’t the other guy.”

“And if Marinette didn’t have hanahaki because she doesn’t love Adrien!” Juleka almost shouted, startling everyone with her uncharacteristic volume.

“You didn’t realise she was into Luka either!” Alya shouted back, the accusation made sharper with her own fear and guilt. Her gaze flicked away to take in the circle of girls around them. “None of you did. You were all on board with those stupid plans, remember? Operation Secret Garden? You were all coming up with ideas and flower codenames and stuff for that – “

“Yeah, when it was Marinette’s idea in the first place,” Alix interjected.

Alya’s eyes narrowed at Alix, and shifted to skim over Mylène, with Ivan hovering uncertainly in the background. She glanced at Rose, and Juleka, who had come to her feet with the bucket forgotten beside her and her fingers going white with tension where they gripped the mop handle. Alya came back to Alix again.

“You all thought she was in love with Adrien, too. She’s always said she’s in love with Adrien. If she’d just told the truth, none of this would be happening,” Alya said, and Alix snorted.

“When she did, you didn’t listen.”

“I –“

“It wasn’t a clue when she kept dodging you hard every time you tried to push her and Adrien together?” Alix threw up her hands. “Not my fault you didn’t listen to any of us.”

“Yeah, not your problem, not your show,” Alya mimicked savagely. “At least I was doing my best to help Marinette!”

“And look how well that worked out for her,” Juleka said under her breath, and Alya rounded on her.

“At least I was trying to do something!” Alya repeated sharply. “It’s only because it’s your brother who’s involved that you’re blaming me for not figuring it out, but you just sat there and said nothing, every time we talked about how to get Marinette and Adrien together, so what does that say about you, if you knew Marinette liked Luka and didn’t say anything? And if you thought Marinette was into Adrien, like the rest of us did, then you’re even worse for blaming me when I was just trying to help her get the guy she’d said she wanted!”

Alya hated herself for the tears that were welling up in Juleka’s eyes, but she was in too deep to stop.

Rose had seen Juleka’s reaction too, and her eyes narrowed. She planted herself protectively in front of Juleka, tiny and fierce and bristling at Alya. Alya would have laughed, if she wasn’t such a roiling, defensive mess.

“That’s not fair!” Rose said furiously. “We didn’t know about the hanahaki. You and Marinette didn’t tell any of us. And no one knew she was in love with Luka, not even you, and you’re supposed to be her best friend! You’re the one who keeps saying you know her better than anyone else – if anyone should have known, it was you!”

“How was I supposed to know, when Marinette’s been keeping all these secrets from me?” Alya cried bitterly.

On the outskirts of the circle, Kagami said quietly, “Except Marinette told you that she was no longer in love with Adrien. Why didn’t you believe her?”

And Alya didn’t have an answer.

Alya glanced around the wreckage, the petals still stuck to the deck, and the abandoned instruments on the stage. And she replayed in her head all the times Marinette had insisted she didn’t love Adrien anymore. She counted over all the times she’d teased Marinette about Luka, how she’d thought it was so funny when Marinette would blush at the mention of his name, and all the time Marinette had been spending on the Liberty with the band, and Luka.

Luka, who looked at Marinette as if she was everything in the world to him.

Luka, soaked in Marinette’s blood as he held her, her face as pale as death.

It had been too quiet down below deck for too long now, and Alya was gripped with a sudden fear for her best friend.

Everyone had fallen silent, their eyes on Alya.

And Alya turned and fled below in search of reassurance.

~~~~~

Down in the bowels of the Liberty, Alya pushed her way past the galley kitchen to a door standing open on the cabin Luka shared with Juleka. Through the open doorway, she could make out Marinette’s unconscious form in the rumpled mess of blankets on Luka’s bed. Luka was huddled on the floor beside her, his forehead pressed to his knees and one hand stretched up awkwardly to hold Marinette’s hand where it dangled over the edge of the mattress. His phone lay face up on the floor next to him.

Alya shifted uncomfortably in the hallway, and Luka looked up at the sound. His face was still ashy pale under his tan, and streaked with tears. Before she could come in, he got to his feet and gently tucked Marinette’s hand back under the blanket, then moved to meet Alya in the doorway. She could see the way his hands shook before he closed them tightly at his sides. He had the look in his eyes of a man who didn’t yet dare trust in a gallows reprieve.

“Is she going to be alright?” she asked abruptly, afraid.

“She’s okay. She’s going to be okay,” he repeated, more to himself than to Alya, and scrubbed a hand across his face, smearing the tear tracks. It sounded like he was trying to convince himself.

“Is she awake yet?” Alya asked. He shook his head.

“She’s still unconscious. I called the ambulance. They’ll be here in a minute, and her parents are on their way to the hospital,” he said distantly. “Quicker to meet her there than coming here.”

They could hear the wail of an ambulance siren getting closer now. Over the soft lap of the waves against the hull Alya could hear the approaching siren give one final whoop, and then cut out as the ambulance pulled up to the dock.

“I didn’t know it was you,” she said in a small voice. “She didn’t tell me.”

“Do you wonder why?” Luka said, and the tone of his voice was the closest to anger that Alya had ever heard from him. There was a long beat of silence, and then Luka let out a heavy breath. “She didn’t tell me either,” he said more softly. “She didn’t feel like she could talk to any of us, and that’s how the hanahaki took root in the first place.”

There were voices and firm footsteps on the deck above them, and then the cabin was full of paramedics and bags of equipment. Alya flattened herself out of the way against the wall as they tested Marinette’s vitals and held low-voiced consultations that were broken by the occasional request for information.

In response to one question about how long ago the first symptoms had shown up, Luka said, “I’m not sure. About three weeks?”

He glanced at Alya for confirmation, and she nodded, her head feeling wobbly with the effort.

“She seemed even more exhausted than usual back around then,” Luka went on, “and had a bit of a cough right after… what day was it when Adrien first turned up here?” he asked Alya. “I noticed she seemed a bit off right after that, but I thought… I thought…”

Alya knew what he’d thought. She’d thought the same thing, but they were both wrong.

Marinette stirred, but didn’t wake up, as the paramedics briskly shifted her from the bed to a narrow gurney and manoeuvred her through the doorway. Alya could hear the firm, quiet voices receding down the length of the boat, and the muted thump of feet and equipment easing their way up the steps and onto the deck.

Alya was a little startled when Luka scooped up a backpack and moved to follow them.

“Luka, what are you going to do?”

“Go with her. In the ambulance if they’ll let me. Or follow on my bike if they won’t. I don’t want her to be alone when she wakes up.” The muscles in his jaw clenched. There was something fierce and immovable in his eyes that Alya would never have expected to see in the easy-going guitarist, and another shiver ran through her.

“Tell her… tell her…” Alya trailed off, unsure of what she wanted to say. There was too much she wanted to tell Marinette, and Luka was watching her with those eyes that saw far more than Alya was comfortable with.

“Maybe this time,” he said, “we listen to Marinette instead.”

And then he was gone, leaving Alya alone in the bowels of the boat with her thoughts.

#lukanette #pro lukamari #ml au #Chrysanthemum White and Blood Red #hanahaki #back up the angst truck #luka couffaine #miraculous ladybug

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ilikekidsshows · 6 months ago

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About you being harassed by Marinette fans. I don't know if me doing this is weird, but you being open bout that makes me want to open up more too. I've send you 4 anons by now (u probably could already tell they were from one person) because I don't have a miraculous Blog anymore since the hiatus before Destruction because Marinette fans found one of my posts criticizing Marinette's treatment of Cat Noir and her leadership and they went after me for i think almost an entire week. I ended up deleting my blog in panic and fear of it getting worse the more traffic it got amongst Mari stans.

I followed the show and Fandom til now from afar to see if any of my Marinette problems were getting the fixes everyone screamed about season 5 would deliver but I can't say that happened. I wholeheartedly agree that with alot of other people that it only got worse with the doubling down and her gettin less heroic underneath the surface.

So I'm still here and upset that I was bullied out of this fandom for things I was apparently right about to degrees I didn't even knew back then how right I'd end up being....

I found a couple of blogs to follow that share my opinions and you guys have been interwoven alot now so I thought sending anons to dip my toe back into being part of the discourse is a good idea. I hope I didn't cause any Mari stans getting angry at you for it, I've been worried bout that ngl.

I would like to ask bout one of the topics Marinette fans cyberbullied me for but I still think I'm right for questioning:

How much value does Marinette see in being friends with her love interests?

Oc im not doubting that she sees at least some worth in it, but it feels very shallow. Fandom is working the lion's share to take what little canon gives and run with it til they think their fanon is real.

Marinette values friendship, sure, but Zoe is the only love interest of hers for whom that feels right to say

Marinette in Canon has said many times that for her being friends with the one she loves is the worst thing she could possibly imagine. E. g. Psycomedian. And she was rewarded with Adrien being her devoted and desperate prince for her doing probably the most friendship related thing she did in all season 4. She had a basic little convo with him about understanding to have problems and that's where it ended. Where did Marinette ever even try to be rlly Adrien's friend? She said 500x that she's finally gonna put her romance feelings aside for a bit to focus on her job (which I hoped would mean she'd work on her weaknesses in the platonic Ladynoir team dynamic too... Silly me... )

But that never goes anywhere? Weren't Adrien and Kagami the ones literally having been created out of the feeling love or to love someone in particular and even THEY could overwrite their senti programming better than Marinette ever could get over her normal ass feelings for a week? Adrien and Kagami value the friendship with the one they love deeply, is that the difference? That Marinette can't ever move one from loving someone because friendship feels like an awful downgrade and torture to her so she stays the same? What does that say bout her?

Or that Luka and Cat Noir never caused her stalker paranoia to break out that Derision claims she does to protect herself. Why does it only apply to Adrien? And not even Cat Noir, too? In my other anons I brought up how awful I think it is that Marinette seemingly has no interest in leaning anything rlly about the boy underneath Cat Noir's mask, now she barely acts like she remembers that he's real and that they'll one day reveal where he'll then find out how many times she deliberately deceived him with her civilian identity in very hurtful ways.

How does that correspond to her being in love and more important for my question, what does that level of refusal to treat someone like a real person say about her willingness to be Cat's friend? Cause I can't see friendship in Ladynoir anymore. Marinette was the one who killed that in season 4 and then season 5 didn't improve her in much. Friends don't treat each other the way Marinette so easily uses, hurts ignores, silences and deceives Cat Noir without batting an eye.

The only effort she really made was before Kwamis choice. When she thought he was still in love with her and expected that s4 magically caused no damage to his feelings for her. she seemingly thought she could just allow him to dedicate himself to her for an overall easy way to sweep everything under the rug and make him "happy" again without her ever having to really try and do better herself because that was the comfort she was seeking at that time (shoutout to Familyagrestefanblog and erisluna35. I've been paraphrasing them alot and wanted mention that too. Didn't get to write out my own opinion in a while and I agree with them x})

This refusal to face her hurtful actions of s4 quickly developed into her craving for him to give her his easy love and not wanting to take anything less than precisely the endless devotion she wanted from him now. No matter what the price. No matter how much it put him too in danger (what even meant Cat Blanc?), and yet, still no interest in him as a person.

Once she had to take the no, she left and then she never again made a genuine effort in Ladynoir. Any effort to better herself was romance related. Determination may have been the episode where she rlly noticed her changed feelings for him, but she did try earlier than that. But it fully stopped with his no as did her changed feelings vanish as quickly as they showed up. So what does that say about her and how she views their "friendship"?

Season 4 has her already show that she doesn't want Ladynoir to be an actual friendship since she treats him barely better than a magical pet she rarely ever thinks about, which caught her off guard over and over that she isn't being the kindest and adoring person of all time to him. She treats him so much worse than her actual friends and in s5 she isn't trying to build a real connection beyond wanting him to shower her in his devotion and love.

What season 5 shows bout Marinette's view of the Ladynoir friendship is in my most generous reading her not getting to hide behind any romantic feelings from either side that she doesn't know how to be his friend, after she had to learn in season 4 that she was a really really bad one. But even with that generous reading, it would still mean that Marinette then went on prioritizing not having to feel any further discomfort or having to owe up for her actual mistakes in their bond over her finally being the friend she SHOULD think Cat Noir deserves. A friend he desperately needed but never got cause she called it a day with her personal needs being met my having her best friend Alya with her.

Friends don't do that. Marinette denied him any genuine friendship he obviously truly needed as Cat Noir because she personally didn't need it from him anymore cause of Alya. And he rejected her desire to now be adored by him so there was no purpose left anymore for him to fulfill in her life besides the easy partner she made clear cant ask shit from her.

That is so unbelievably selfish... How on earth is that supposed to be FRIENDSHIP?

Srry, for this being long. Last point.

Luka of course needs to be mentioned too. Sure, the show says they are friends. But are they really? Their friendship is built on him being her platonic therapist back-up boyfriend who doesn't ask shit of her either. This is still the same pattern as with Catrien. Luka does all the emotional labor and Marinette just takes and takes and that's what makes her so comfortable around him but she isn't interested in him either beyond what she sees day to day in front of her.

That doesn't count as friendship in my book. For Adrigami you can still feel their friendship after their breakup. But Lukanette is Luka being a platonic therapist boyfriend and Marinette being just as disinterested in him as with Cat Noir while being just as comfortable getting showered in emotional labor that she's unwilling to work on giving back the way she should.

How is that friendship? What value has friendship for Marinette once any romantic feelings are involved from either side and it isn't Zoé (feels like a homophobic backhanded compliment lmao)

That was very long, I apologize. But thanks to writing in anon I started becoming more comfortable with the idea of joining the Fandom discourse again. I've got alot I wanna say after all that time in silence but I'm not sure yet if I should put myself out there again with a blog. With how season 5 ended Marinette stans are gonna be vicious beasts to any criticism they come across and I don't want that to happen again :(

---

I hope this isn't a case of speak of the devil and he shall appear but lately things have been really quiet on the Marinette stan front. The worst I’ve gotten was this really unhinged one, but they were so unpleasant they didn't have any friends so the harassment was very one-note and stopped pretty quickly since they had to run it alone. It could be that now that season 5 confirmed that season 4 wasn't an outlier, that the show’s writing has gotten incredibly sloppy and nasty, the critical side of the fandom has become unified and we add to each other’s posts and kind of back each other up. It's harder for Marinette stans to target us one by one, and their preferred tactic is dogpiling a single blog. A lot of the Marinette stans protesting my posts now shut up right quick when they see more people agreeing with me adding to the reblog chain.

As for the question, I agree with your assessment. It really does appear that Marinette hates the idea of being friends with a love interest. She whined about Adrien seeing her as just a friend all the way back in Riposte. Adrien sung her praises to Kagami, while she spied on them, and she had the gall to whine that the boy she “loves” thinks so highly of her because it wasn't the kind of thinking she wanted.

There was this one thing I said in a previous post that I think is accurate: Marinette part-times being Cat Noir's friend. Even the part of time she acts as his friend, she ignores his feelings, insults him, pushes him away, refuses to give him emotional support in any way and lies to him about anything she possibly can. She only approaches him as Marinette when she wants to complain about Adrien not coming to the date he didn't know was a date, when she thinks she can score a date with him or so that she can practice confessing to Adrien on him. Marinette's “friendship” with Cat Noir is all take with no give when she isn't outright ignoring his existence.

She also ignores boys who have feelings for her in her civilian life. Nathaniel is very suspicious of her in Reverser, having to be convinced that she wasn't planning to humiliate him, implying he isn't part of her friend group since he doesn't know her well enough to know she only humiliates people when they're in her way of getting at Adrien. (Alix makes it sound like she wouldn't do that period, but we know the truth by now.) She also refused to come to Juleka and Luka's shared birthday party if Luka was present after they broke up. I bet if you tried to tell Marinette, or her writers, that your romantic partner should also be your best friend to make a healthy relationship, they just wouldn't compute.

I don't want to say Marinette doesn't hold friendship in high regard period, because the amount of exceptions she makes for Alya shows that she at least values Alya’s friendship. I think she just doesn't value friendship with boys. I feel like Marinette is the kind of person who doesn't think boys and girls can really be friends, which would explain why she thinks Adrien considering her a friend is worse than anything else. If boys can't really be friends with girls, Adrien using the word “friends�� means they aren't even that.

Consider this: how often does Marinette hang out with her guy classmates when it isn't 1) a whole-class outing or 2) more likely that Marinette just wanted to hang out with his girlfriend? Like, in Animan, Marinette had no idea Nino had a crush on her, but she still acted like an outing with him at the zoo was the worst thing ever. I get that she was disappointed Adrien wasn't there, but Nino is one of Marinette’s oldest classmates, yet she doesn't want to spend time with him, unless she's planning to use him to get closer to Adrien, since he's Adrien’s best friend.

Of course, she doesn't really value the time with her other friends for its own sake outside of Alya either. It seems like the only times they hang out together is to plot or participate in her get Adrien quick schemes. The only times the girls do something not Marinette related is when Marinette hasn't called them together, like when they were going to the pool in Gorizilla, something Marinette completely forgot until Alya called her. Marinette has poor memory but, despite her knowing she has poor memory, she apparently gave herself no reminder to hang out with her friends. You bet I write down every occasion I’ve agreed to see my friends specifically because I have bad memory as well.

It seems like, unless you're Alya, Marinette only cares about you for how able and willing you are to help her catch Adrien's attention. I keep saying Marinette treats her Adrien romancing problems as the most important thing going on at any given moment, and it's true for all areas of her life. Maybe that's the reason we didn't see Socqueline for four seasons despite her supposedly being such an important friend to Marinette, and why she never joined the friend group proper; Socqueline couldn't help her get with Adrien so she wasn't worth Marinette’s time.

This is a yet another thing where Miraculous is actually pretty sexist; girls and boys can't ever just be friends and girls care more about getting guys than they do about their friends. Another thing of course is this idea that boys just don't have as in-depth feelings as girls or should bury their feelings and never ask for emotional support, which is why all of Marinette's love interests are her emotional support dispensers whose opinions on anything don’t matter when their job is to simply mindlessly worship Marinette while their feelings are devalued by the narrative every time they dare to try to ask Marinette for some support back. Luka gets Akumatized which convinces him to break up with Marinette when he had emotional needs she wasn't willing to fulfill. Meanwhile Adrien goes through the travesty that is Kuro Neko

“Power of love always so strong” but only when it's Marinette's toxic idea of love and when it isn't platonic love. Unless you're Alya, I guess.

#ml salt #ml writers salt

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